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View Full Version : Arrow selection for vintage #45 grizzly



garyson1311
April 5th, 2012, 05:03 PM
Hey guys I am just getting into traditional archery and picked up a 1973 Grizzly #45 that is in GREAT shape. I also got one of bearbowmans flemish strings (Awesome string!) set up with a 7 3/4 brace and I am now trying to get some arrows set up. I wouldnt mind trying hunting with it but for now, I will be hitting up some 3d comps. My buddy had a half dozen easton 2213 xx75 platinum shafts that were cut at 28 1/2 laying around and according to eastons "hunting" chart, these arrows would fit the bill with a 125gn tip. I set one up with a 125gn tip and 4 inch feathers and it seems to shoot really straight, no fishtail, no wrist shock, loud string sound etc. (Compared to some 2315 camo hunters I had laying around that fishtailed all over the place because I thought they were way too stiff for the bow and checking eastons chart confirmed it). I just wanted to see what you guys thought about that set up with the 2213's? If it isnt a healthy set up for the bow i'd buy new shafts (probably carbon like my wheelbow's arrows) but I am assuming that if it fits on eastons chart, flys well, and the bow seems to react ok to them I should have nothing to worry about.. Plus, that'd save me a few bucks! Id still really like to hear your opinions though. Thanks a million. Btw, the total arrow weight I am getting from these arrows is 450 grains +/- 2ish grains which gives me about 10gpp on the bow. I am pulling it to about 28".

guyver
April 5th, 2012, 05:12 PM
...I am assuming that if it fits on eastons chart, flys well, and the bow seems to react ok to them I should have nothing to worry about.. Plus, that'd save me a few bucks!...

If it works, it works... and I get what your saying bout the $. You may actually be over-spined (need a weaker spine) but if they're flying fine then dont worry about it for now. I shoot a similar arrow (2117/400) out of a 55# @29". I suggest looking up bareshaft tuning in these forums or google it.

garyson1311
April 5th, 2012, 05:17 PM
If it is overspined is that bad for the bow at all?

guyver
April 5th, 2012, 05:28 PM
nope

ChadMR82
April 5th, 2012, 05:51 PM
I have a 1964 45# Grizz that spits out 29 inch Easton Legacy 1916 arrows very nice. I only draw 27.25. I have a 125 grain field point plus two brass washers (5 grains each) behind the field point for a total of 135 grains. Works very well for me. I personally find it hard to get 10 gpp with carbon. Not saying it can not be done, I just find it easier to do with aluminum. BTW, an overspined or underspined arrow is a waste of energy. You will not know the perfect setup until you paper tune or bare shaft. I would think a full length 1916 would be a great place to start (if you don't mind aluminum). You may be into .600 spine carbon depending on your bow. The .600's are all light and you may struggle getting up to 10 gpp. A .500 spine might work with enough tip weight up front and left long enough. The Beman MFX Classics are a good arrow and a little heavier to help reach your intended weight goal. There are a lot of good people on this site and you will get a lot of good advice. What works for one person with the same setup as yours may not work for you. Every setup is different. 3Rivers has test kits with different spines of arrows. May save you some $ in the long run. Have fun and wecome to the madness.

rembrandt
April 5th, 2012, 05:55 PM
I have the Bear Kodiak Hunter at 45lbs and the GT 3555s fit it very well.......Traditional carbon arrows and they are good, tough arrows.

northern boy
April 5th, 2012, 06:04 PM
Shooting a b-50 string you will need a weaker spine arrow for sure the 2213 are 0.460 spine arrow to stiff a 600 spine carbon gt 15/35 or carbon express 20/40 left full lenght would be a better choice an you will be in the 400-450 range for weight. You can get a modern string for the bow an grain about 10 fps over the b-50 plus less hand shock lot of people using new strings on old bows I do an it works great.

ChadMR82
April 5th, 2012, 06:25 PM
I would stick with b-50 just to be safe. Vintage bows were not made for FF string material. Just my .02.

northern boy
April 5th, 2012, 06:51 PM
I have to disagree thinking you have to use b-50 is old thinking many people have very good luck an some thinks it,s actually easier on the bow less string viberation. I tried it on 5 different older bows an all are shooting so much better then b-50. I use a 8 strand of d-10 with loops padded to 14. if you pad the loops you won,t rip the tips off. Try it the griz will like it an so will the shooter.

garyson1311
April 5th, 2012, 07:14 PM
Good to know.. Thanks for the input, guys. I will shoot these and eventually see about getting some lighter arrows. I just wanted to double check and make sure that shooting these arrows (even if they are a bit overspined) wont hurt my vintage grizz?

Curve1
April 5th, 2012, 07:50 PM
1916 with 125 grain point should fly good all day long out of that bow at your 28 inch draw. 2016 will fly good but may have to go to 29 inch arrow with 150-175 grain point.
You can go to 12 strand string b-50 and that will be plenty for that poundage.

garyson1311
April 6th, 2012, 01:20 PM
So I was doing some experimenting with what I had (1 2213 w/125g tip and 1 2013 w/125g tip.. Both being easton platinum) and I noticed while they hit the target decent enough, the 2013 flies quite it bit more true. Ive noticed the 2013 is a bit more forgiving if I pluck the string as opposed to the 2213 which fishtails a little if I pluck. If I get a really clean release on the 2213 it seems to fly well. Both of these arrows are cut to 28 1/2. My question is this.. I got my hands on a half dozen full length uncut 2213 shafts that my buddy had laying around. Do you guys think that adding or subtracting length to the arrow may improve the flight or should I just look to different shafts (trying more 2013 or some 1916? Also, with the 2013 with a 125 tip that puts me at around 8.5 gpp on my bow.. Thats a little light isnt it?

JINKSTER
April 6th, 2012, 02:25 PM
So I was doing some experimenting with what I had (1 2213 w/125g tip and 1 2013 w/125g tip.. Both being easton platinum) and I noticed while they hit the target decent enough, the 2013 flies quite it bit more true. Ive noticed the 2013 is a bit more forgiving if I pluck the string as opposed to the 2213 which fishtails a little if I pluck. If I get a really clean release on the 2213 it seems to fly well. Both of these arrows are cut to 28 1/2. My question is this.. I got my hands on a half dozen full length uncut 2213 shafts that my buddy had laying around. Do you guys think that adding or subtracting length to the arrow may improve the flight or should I just look to different shafts (trying more 2013 or some 1916? Also, with the 2013 with a 125 tip that puts me at around 8.5 gpp on my bow.. Thats a little light isnt it?

garyson...here's a few pointers of how i like to tune recurves..

First?..i like an arrow shaft diameter that when i line up the string with the center of the limbs looking at the arrow nocked from the backside?..i like to see the arrows entire tip angling "JUST" to the outboard side of the string...choosing the shaft diameter wisely can help avoid doing things like having to thin-out or build-out strike plates..(i.e. where your shaft rests against the side of the riser)

Secondly?..i like to leave the shafts full length...the extra length gives a better visual of arrow alignment and keeps the spine value down so you don't hafta load on a bunch of tip weight to get'em to fly straight...but some archers do favor a lot of weight forward..FOC value.

Thirdly?..i like to final tune my arrows using various tip weights..heavier tip weights will get the spine to act weaker...lighter tip weights will get the spine to act stiffer..there are also numerous shaft offerings that provide for "Insert Weights'...some are of the "break away" style (like eastons axis arrows) others provide various "screw in" insert weight systems (like goldtip arrow shafts).

and just fer reference?...

My 54# recurve likes 29" long .400 spine w/ 175gr points while my 44# longbow likes 30" long .500 spine w/ 175gr points.

all i got...hope that helps...welcome to the addiction and L8R, Bill. :cool:

garyson1311
April 6th, 2012, 02:32 PM
Good to know. Thank you for the input. So I just downloaded stu millers dyanmic calculator and am playing with it. Full length shafts eh? Is that pretty common to shoot long(er) shafts with a recurve? I saw that eastons arrow chart goes up into the mid 30's in terms of arrow inch length so I just thought it was for those long draw shooters. So its not just determined by adding an inch or 2 to your draw?

JINKSTER
April 6th, 2012, 02:45 PM
Good to know. Thank you for the input. So I just downloaded stu millers dyanmic calculator and am playing with it. Full length shafts eh? Is that pretty common to shoot long(er) shafts with a recurve? I saw that eastons arrow chart goes up into the mid 30's in terms of arrow inch length so I just thought it was for those long draw shooters. So its not just determined by adding an inch or 2 to your draw?

nope...that would jack your spine value recommendation up quite a bit...you wanna stick with your actual draw length...and just leave the shafts long..the good news of doing it that way is two fold..

1. You get to stick with a lighter point weight...which in turn yeilds a lighter overall arrow weight..which in turn will yeild a flat shooting screamer of a bow. :)

2. If your arrows do exhibit weak spine?..besides reducing point weight (like above) you have the option to chop a little off...but order'em up too stiff?..and you're screwed unless you add on a ton of tip weight and wind up with a slow shooting bow and arrows with the arc of a rainbow.

I'm not real content with my 44# longbow .500 spine arrows needing 175grs of point weight to act right..it would be faster and flatter with .600 spine arrows which could drop down to 125 maybe even 100gr points...making a far lighter, hence faster, flatter shooting arrow while still retaining OAL. Get it? :)

garyson1311
April 6th, 2012, 03:01 PM
Hmm I think I get it.. So much more to this than I thought! Okay so I wanna spit some numbers and see what you guys think... According to this "Stu Miller" calculator heres the figures for my bow and my 2213 shafts (uncut at the moment) that I have laying around to match up.. I would need them to be 32" long (which is full length right?) with 125gn tip which gives my arrows a 13.6% FOC, 10.6 GPP, and dynamic spine of 51.2 lbs and my bow requires 49.3. The calc says as long as they are within 2lbs you should have a good starting point. So with all that mumbo jumbo being said, does a 32" 2213 shaft with a 125gn tip sound it would make sense flying out of a 1973 Bear Grizzly 58amo #45? I'm not trying to be the ultimate cheapskate but if I can make something with what I have, i'd like to try. If not, ill go blow a few bux.

garyson1311
April 6th, 2012, 03:22 PM
Then again, this info is a bit different than "eastons target chart" which states that with a 125gn tip, my 2213's at 29 1/2 inches would be good. Kinda confused..

martha j
April 6th, 2012, 03:32 PM
go with a 1916 & 125 point imho.

RecurvesOnly
April 6th, 2012, 04:50 PM
It seems a lot of arrow sizes work here. With my 45# grizzly (my draw length is 30") 2018 and 2117 125 gr both work exceptionally well.