Proposed California Legislation

[JRF20]

It is really becoming difficult for me to remain associated with this state...

http://www.sacbee.com/111/story/110337.html

Your thoughts?

[Dredly]

members only... post the article contents on here

[JRF20]

Sorry, here it is:

Spank your child, go to jail?

California would become the first state to explicitly ban spanking for children younger than 4 under legislation to be introduced next week.

Slapping, smacking, whacking or kicking also would be outlawed.

Assemblywoman Sally Lieber, a Mountain View Democrat who is crafting the measure, said corporal punishment victimizes helpless children and contributes to a society "addicted to violence."

"The only thing a child learns by being beaten is that it's OK to beat or dominate children or animals that are smaller," she said.

"To my mind, there's no amount of physical force that's appropriate on a child 3 years old or younger," Lieber said.

Critics blasted Lieber's proposal Thursday as silly and excessive, or "nanny government" that would step on parents' toes and force judges to decide whether a swat was a spank, a nudge, a push or a "love tap."

Assemblyman Bill Maze, R-Visalia, called the measure "absolutely outrageous."

"What do doctors do when a child is born?" Maze said, laughing. "They spank the child."

Assemblyman Ted Gaines, R-Roseville, said he doesn't condone abusive practices but that a little swat, judiciously applied, should be left to parents' discretion.

"If I was talking in church, I'd get thumped in the head with a prayer book once in a while," Gaines said. "It worked."

Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger has taken no position on the measure, press secretary Aaron McLear said.

In an interview with the San Jose Mercury News, Schwarzenegger, who said that he and his wife "never" spank their four children, hinted that he has concerns about how the bill could be enforced. "Is it that when you see someone spank a kid, you go and say, 'Can I see the birth certificate of the kid?' "

But Schwarzenegger also said that he understands the desire to "get rid of the physical, the brutal behavior that some parents have."

Critics noted that abusing a child, though not a simple swat, already is illegal and must be reported by doctors, social workers and others.

Lieber said her measure would make spanking a misdemeanor, subject to a maximum one-year jail term and $1,000 fine.

But Thomas Nazario, a University of San Francisco Law School professor who has helped develop the bill, said the goal is to change behavior -- not incarcerate parents or remove children from homes.

"My guess is that people would get a citation," Nazario said. "They might go to court and, as a result of that citation, have to take a parenting class."

There also is a possibility that criminal sanctions will be drop-ped, meaning the bill simply would serve notice that parents no longer could inflict pain on their children, he said.

Nazario, a specialist in civil and children's rights, said California law currently permits spanking by parents unless the degree of force is excessive or not age-appropriate.

Usually, the state doesn't intervene unless a parent "uses a closed fist, or creates a welt, or black-and-blue mark, breaks the skin or uses an (instrument) on the child," he said.

Lieber's anti-spanking proposal, for children under 4, targets youngsters who are "absolutely defenseless" and "can't really talk to anyone else about what's going on in their lives, Nazario said.

"They don't understand the connection between their conduct and the spanking," he said.

Teachers and child care workers already are banned from spanking, Lieber said.

"If a teacher can control 30-plus students by using voice control only, then a parent can do that in the home," she said.

Lieber said passage of her bill could prompt a supermarket shopper, for example, to approach a fellow shopper who is spanking a child and warn, "That's against the law in California."

But Sacramento County Sheriff John McGinness said such confrontations can be risky.

"I don't think that would necessarily be in the best interest of any of the parties," he said.

McGinness said that an anti-spanking law, if passed as a misdemeanor, could be enforced only by citizen's arrest or by a peace officer who witnessed the corporal punishment.

Critics said a spanking prohibition could spark a torrent of calls to overloaded law-enforcement and child protective agencies, but Lieber disagreed, saying problems didn't occur when corporal punishment was banned in schools.

Child behavior experts are divided on spanking as punishment.

For many years, the conventional wisdom in the early-childhood education community was that child spanking is unacceptable in all circumstances, said Kimberly Gordon Biddle, an associate professor of child development at California State University, Sacramento.

But during the past 10 years, research has indicated that a "light tap," accompanied by an explanation, can be effective in cases where toddlers are endangering themselves or others, she said.

Personally, she said, "I just think there are so many other alternatives out there that you don't need it."

Pedestrians contacted randomly Thursday in downtown Sacramento had mixed feelings.

"I'd say leave it to the parents," said Lupe De Leon, 63, of Tulare.

LaQuetta Copeland, 62, of Wilton said she likes the idea of protecting children but can envision a situation where a youngster is behaving dangerously and parents respond with a quick swat out of "fright or fear."

"I'd hate to see them in trouble," she said.

[affe22]

Just another step in removing the ideals of personal responsibility from our society.

[Dredly]

Show me one teacher that can control a class by "voice control alone" under the 6th grade... 1/2 the teachers out there cannot control a class at all and the other 1/2 have detention, suspension, in school suspension, and the principal to keep the children in line.

And what does a kid have to worry about when they get home? a stern speaking to? I can see it now

parent: Johnny your teacher called and said you have a 3 day out of school suspension for talking back to her

Johnny: Yeah I needed the vacation. I'll go to my room now.

[Rice rocket]

Unfortunally this is what the American people what. Every time we elect liberals with socialistic ideas this is the direction we go. :hurt:

Bet this thread ends up in campfire

[bissen00]

there is nothing rong with a spanking you learn fast if it hurts. make a poll and see how many people on here have been spanked before bet most have.
bissen

[36fan]

LOL - only in the Republik of Kalifornia

The only reason a stern talk walked on me with my parents, is that I learned the hard way it would be quickly followed by a swat on @$$ if I didn't listen and mind!

I'm guessing the governator doesn't spank his kids because they are intimdated by him and his size and he has never had to. All Maria has to do to get the kids to mind is say, "I'm telling your father when he gets home!"

[Dredly]

LOL - only in the Republik of Kalifornia

The only reason a stern talk walked on me with my parents, is that I learned the hard way it would be quickly followed by a swat on @$$ if I didn't listen and mind!

I'm guessing the governator doesn't spank his kids because they are intimdated by him and his size and he has never had to. All Maria has to do to get the kids to mind is say, "I'm telling your father when he gets home!"

funny I heard that line a lot when I was a kid "If you don't sit down I'm telling your father!"

[Midlife Crisis]

Sally Lieber isn't saying she's against spanking. She just wants people to be old enough to appreciate a good spanking - like her.:ROFLMAO:

[Dchiefransom]

This is almost as good as the law they tried to get through before. If you discovered someone was illegally in your home, YOU had to get out or face prosecution.