Simple question: Shorten the string and you increase or decrease draw weight?



# Thread: Simple question: Shorten the string and you increase or decrease draw weight?

1. ## Simple question: Shorten the string and you increase or decrease draw weight?

I always thought that adding twists to your string does two things, shortens your draw length and increases your draw weight. I've read conflicting things on this and I'm just wanting to get it strait in my head (not saying much concidering how twisted my head gets from time to time ). What's the correct answer?

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3. shorten

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5. Shortens the draw and also decrease the weight. To what extent-----depends on the twists, your would have to get between 5 to 10 twists to start to notice much of anything.

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7. ## post

Originally Posted by Dale_B1
Shortens the draw and also decrease the weight. To what extent-----depends on the twists, your would have to get between 5 to 10 twists to start to notice much of anything.
I agree

8. Originally Posted by Dale_B1
Shortens the draw and also decrease the weight. To what extent-----depends on the twists, your would have to get between 5 to 10 twists to start to notice much of anything.
X2 !!

9. Originally Posted by Dale_B1
Shortens the draw and also decrease the weight. To what extent-----depends on the twists, your would have to get between 5 to 10 twists to start to notice much of anything.
Yes, sir.

FYI: Cables have the opposite effect. Shortening the cables will increase the draw weight and draw length.

10. Shorten the string-->decrease the poundage.

11. OK, I'm convinced. So how would one go about increasing the draw weight without increasing the draw length (x-force if it matters)?

12. Originally Posted by GimpyPaw
OK, I'm convinced. So how would one go about increasing the draw weight without increasing the draw length (x-force if it matters)?
Stiffer limbs.

Sometimes you can increase the weight a pound or two by shortening everything(string and cables) to create more preload. I wouldn't advise this in your case, as you're bow is quite heavily preloaded from the factory.

13. Originally Posted by GimpyPaw
OK, I'm convinced. So how would one go about increasing the draw weight without increasing the draw length (x-force if it matters)?
Ok now that we know what your asking-------finish the whole story. How many pounds more, are you just tweaking, is the bow under the max poundage now-------need to give everything to get the correct answers. Kind of like going into a tire dealer and saying can I put 60# of air in A tire----the correct question would be can I put 60# of air in wheel borrow tire---see what I mean.

14. Originally Posted by GimpyPaw
OK, I'm convinced. So how would one go about increasing the draw weight without increasing the draw length (x-force if it matters)?
different modules, cables and strings, cams ,and heavier limbs will all change you're draw!

15. Originally Posted by Don Beaver
Yes, sir.

FYI: Cables have the opposite effect. Shortening the cables will increase the draw weight and draw length.
X2. just gave cable 1 full twist to sinc cams and gained 2.5 lbs

16. Originally Posted by Dale_B1
Ok now that we know what your asking-------finish the whole story. How many pounds more, are you just tweaking, is the bow under the max poundage now-------need to give everything to get the correct answers. Kind of like going into a tire dealer and saying can I put 60# of air in A tire----the correct question would be can I put 60# of air in wheel borrow tire---see what I mean.
Two years ago I took my XForce into the bow shop to have new Winner's Choice string and cables installed. I noticed it felt easier to pull, and checked it to find it went from 70 lb draw to 65 lb. Somehow it also picked up 2 or 3 fps in speed, so I didn't complain.

Now I have my own press and just installed a new set from Bucknasty's. I used the tune charts and the settings the bow was at as my guide. Once again the bow is only pulling 65 lbs.

I put it on the draw board and did some checking...

Currently bow is at:

Axle to Axle = 33 3/16 (33 1/8 spec)
Brace Height = 5 7/8 (5 7/8 spec)
Draw length = 28 3/4 (28 inch draw moduels, set in the neutral post)
Cam timing marks are within 1/2 string's width of string center, with the draw stop and cable flat hitting at the same time.

What I'm looking to do is bring the draw length back into spec, bring the weight back up, and not change the timing of the cams. How?

17. start twisting the cables to get it back to 70# max. Then check the axle to axle and the brace, remember these are aproxmite measuerments only. The other thing is that bow draws longer than the what is expected. ALL new strings and cables need to be tweaked I don't care who made them.

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If you add twists to both the strings and the cable the draw length will remain the same but the draw weight might go up....

19. OK, so in trying to shorten the draw but increase the weight, if I'm reading this correctly, you add twists to BOTH the control and buss cables, right? Any idea or even close aproximation of how many twists to gain 5 lbs? I'm without a scale until one arrives in the mail and it's a drive to get to the bow shop.

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Originally Posted by GimpyPaw
OK, so in trying to shorten the draw but increase the weight, if I'm reading this correctly, you add twists to BOTH the control and buss cables, right? Any idea or even close aproximation of how many twists to gain 5 lbs? I'm without a scale until one arrives in the mail and it's a drive to get to the bow shop.
These bows run long when set to spec. It is hard to get them timed, at 70lbs AND exactly at the stated draw.

I would suggest that you get modules for a 27" draw length. The bow will then pull, when set to spec, right under 28" actual.

Once you do that, you can then tighten the cables until you achieve 70lbs. You must put the same number of twists into each cable to maintain cam timing. On cams where the buss cable slot also provides the draw stop - this is going to increase the draw length. Start with one twist in each - then measure the difference in draw weight. Continue until you are satisfied.

You should then twist the string to get the draw length that you prefer. This will change the draw weight slightly - but not much.

After all this - measure the bow and you should be close to spec. I think PSE considers a bow that is +/- 1/8" on brace and 1/4" on ATA in spec.

One way to look at it is this: The buss/control cables control cam timing and draw weight. Twists cause large changes in these two and a small change in draw length and ATA.

Twists in the string cause a relatively large change in draw length and a smaller change in draw weight. Typically the change in string length affects the ATA - but the more preload, the less effect this will have.

That is why you set draw weight with buss and accept minor draw length changes. You set draw length using modules first, and then fine tune with the string - and accept minor draw weight changes.

But 3/4" is not considered fine tuning - and would typically be beyond the ability of a string/cable to correct without throwing the bow way out of spec somewhere.

And I guess I must ask because I am curious...
If you don't have a scale - how do you know that it is only pulling 65lbs?

21. Originally Posted by IlBuckMaster
And I guess I must ask because I am curious...
If you don't have a scale - how do you know that it is only pulling 65lbs?
It's a half hour drive to get to the bow shop, but I do make the trip frequently enough. I'm going to borrow a scale from somebody tomorrow and twist cables until the bow makes 70 lbs. Then I'll check the draw, and if need be I'll move the string to the minus post to shed an extra 1/2". Thanks.

22. Originally Posted by GimpyPaw
It's a half hour drive to get to the bow shop, but I do make the trip frequently enough. I'm going to borrow a scale from somebody tomorrow and twist cables until the bow makes 70 lbs. Then I'll check the draw, and if need be I'll move the string to the minus post to shed an extra 1/2". Thanks.
Your getting most of it but your missing the main point on draw length CHANGE THE MOUDLE FOR DRAW LENGTH I don't get what your not understanding about the draw length---it's very simple the bow draws long to begin with-----change the module to a shorter one. If you change the post setting then you will have to reset the nock point, kisser and peep if one is used and your not going to gain what you want.

23. Originally Posted by Dale_B1
Your getting most of it but your missing the main point on draw length CHANGE THE MOUDLE FOR DRAW LENGTH I don't get what your not understanding about the draw length---it's very simple the bow draws long to begin with-----change the module to a shorter one. If you change the post setting then you will have to reset the nock point, kisser and peep if one is used and your not going to gain what you want.
Your right, I'm not getting something. I only want to shed about 1/2" draw, at most. If I drop down to a 27" mod I would need to be on the plus post, which is no different than the minus on a 28" mod. What advantage is there to the 27" mod then that I'm not seeing?

24. You'll never get the X-Force to draw the same length as the module setting says it should. I had one with 27" modules on the (-) peg because I was shooting 26.5" at the time, and it was actually drawing 27.5", a full inch longer!

25. Originally Posted by GimpyPaw
Your right, I'm not getting something. I only want to shed about 1/2" draw, at most. If I drop down to a 27" mod I would need to be on the plus post, which is no different than the minus on a 28" mod. What advantage is there to the 27" mod then that I'm not seeing?
In order to take a 1/2" off the draw by twisting your going to throw the whole spec of the bow off by twisting the string that much. It's a bunch of twists to get it down that 1/2" which means your axle to axle and brace are going to suffer a lot, plus your going to loose poundage by a bunch. The bow will draw almost an inch longer than the module says for that bow. If you want to do it properly change the module to an inch shorter one then move the post. I've set up a number of these bows and that is the proper way to do it. It is always better to shoot a bow a tad on the short side that even a very tiny bit on the long side.

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