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Thread: IBO vs ATA (in fps)

  1. #1
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    IBO vs ATA (in fps)

    Somethin fishy is goin on with the 2011 Hoyts. They launched the new bows in ATA which i googled, i guess it means 60lbs 30in draw with 540grn arrow??? The speeds are slow in terms of IBO, but do you think Hoyt is messin with us?? If they are gettin numbers like that in ATA and if i'm correct about what ATA means, then i guess Hoyt doesnt need a speed bow for this year, I'm seriously doubting this.

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  2. #2
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    Nope, someone already clarified this on another thread. ATA is 70#, 30" draw with 350 grain arrow. IBO is 30" draw with 5 grains per pound of draw weight, up to 82#. They also showed the poster of PSE's new models and they're listed as ATA/IBO with the same numbers. Hoyt is still slow.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtprice View Post
    Nope, someone already clarified this on another thread. ATA is 70#, 30" draw with 350 grain arrow. IBO is 30" draw with 5 grains per pound of draw weight, up to 82#. They also showed the poster of PSE's new models and they're listed as ATA/IBO with the same numbers. Hoyt is still slow.
    lol alrighty then!
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  4. #4
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    Wrong.....there is IBO and AMO not ATA for speed ratings. ATA is axle to axle. Hoyt just did a crappy job on where the placed info on the graphics.

  5. #5
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    I actually read that amo changed its name to ata, so they both are the same. But i've read alot of crap over the years...
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    Quote Originally Posted by clg9mm View Post
    Wrong.....there is IBO and AMO not ATA for speed ratings. ATA is axle to axle. Hoyt just did a crappy job on where the placed info on the graphics.
    Wrong.... Hoyt cleared that up.... ATA is the old AMO

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by K&K View Post
    Wrong.... Hoyt cleared that up.... ATA is the old AMO
    hey i was right...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waknstak6 View Post
    hey i was right...
    I dont think any bow will shoot over 300fps amo
    I just searched the ata web site and you have to pay 30$ for the new pamplet explaining it........

  9. #9
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    AMO= 540gr arrow @60# and 30" draw

  10. #10
    One more time When archers merchant org change to Archers Trade Association they did away with the old AMO speed rating and embraced the IBO standard at the time which was.
    30 inch draw
    70 pound pull
    350 grain arrow.
    So they use these specs but call it the New Name ATA instead of IBO. I notice PSE calls theirs ATA/IBO which is saying they adhear to the same specs. in other words they use a 70 pound bow and a 30 inch draw and a 350 grain arrow to test speed.
    you can cheat and go 82 and 410 grain arrow at 30 inches, it is still 5 gains per pound but it more than likely will produce an inflated IBO rating.

    if memory is ok that's how it went down..

  11. #11
    and in Bowtech's case, you use a bow with a 30.49" DL at 82.49 # and an arrow weighing 409.5 gr and do some rounding!

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Archeroni View Post
    and in Bowtech's case, you use a bow with a 30.49" DL at 82.49 # and an arrow weighing 409.5 gr and do some rounding!

    How does one really know what they use when they say 5 grains per pound and don't don't spell out what draw length they use.

  13. #13
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    I saw this too and did a search. I thought thier speeds were pretty impressive for the "old" ATA standard. It's to bad they changed it.

    I really wish they would bring that "old" standard back so we don't have to search countless threads to try and find a real "hunting" speed. A lot more people are interested in 60 lb. bows for hunting these days too.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by K&K View Post
    Wrong.... Hoyt cleared that up.... ATA is the old AMO
    It stands for Archery Trade Assoc.
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    Quote Originally Posted by blueglide1 View Post
    It stands for Archery Trade Assoc.
    yes it does

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    Just to clear things up with the talk on here.

    ATA (Archery Trade Assoc.)- Is strict. Exactly 70lbs. an exact 30 inch draw and exact 350 grain arrow. ATA is also shot with fletching or vanes on the arrow and with a D-loop on the string.

    IBO- 30in +/- .75(usually +) and shot anywhere from 70-82 lbs with a an arrow that is 5 grains per pound. IBO shoots off the string without a d-loop which is a touch faster and they shoot without fletching or vanes on the arrow which cuts down on drag on the arrow so it is faster.

    SO basically when a manufacturer like hoyt says that their bows are getting 330 ATA. It is the most accurate reading you will get because the standards are so strict. Ive actually seen their bows claiming 330 shoot up to 333.(chrono may just be off a tiny bit)

    When a manufacturer says they get 330 IBO, or up to 330 IBO, many times that speed isn't attainable to the normal archer. A lot of the numbers come from bows (Not all) are shot at 80 pounds and the manufacturer doesn't specify that. So people buy the bow thinking they will get 340 or 350 and they end up getting the bow set up to them and its shooting 40-50 or more FPS slower and wonder why.

    When you are looking at new bows, ask the pro shop to set it up to your specs and shoot it through a chrono. Make sure you know the arrow weight you are shooting because it may be different from what you shoot.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Archeroni View Post
    and in Bowtech's case, you use a bow with a 30.49" DL at 82.49 # and an arrow weighing 409.5 gr and do some rounding!
    Really? Better not look at a mathews then!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bees View Post
    How does one really know what they use when they say 5 grains per pound and don't don't spell out what draw length they use.
    I figured this part out last year while running some test on different manufacturers bows.

    I found that draw length used for IBO testing varied according to how much letoff the bow had.

    65% letoff was IBO tested at 30.00"
    70% to 75% letoff was IBO tested at 30.125"
    80% letoff was IBO tested at 30.250"

    In my testing, I found that bows were relatively close to their advertised IBO ratings if i set them up bare string and yes even with fletched arrows weighing in at 350 grains. I did all my testing at 70# and a homemade Hooter Shooter.

    I have not done any testing yet, with the new ATA standard to see how it matches up, but I am confident you won't see much change in the reported speed ratings as they report them as IBO/ATA
    2009 PSE Xforce GX 60#/27 1/2"(283 fps w/366 grain arrow)
    2011 PSE Omen Pro 60#/27 1/2"(298 fps w/382 grain arrow)
    2011 PSE Bow Madness XL 55#/27 1/2"(258 fps w/386 grain arrow)
    2011 PSE Axe-6 58#/27 1/2"(IBO)(298 fps w/300 grain arrow), 55#(ASA)/27 1/2"(287 fps w/305 grain arrow)

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archeroni View Post
    and in Bowtech's case, you use a bow with a 30.49" DL at 82.49 # and an arrow weighing 409.5 gr and do some rounding!
    You couldn't be more wrong... strictly bashing and hating..

    BowTechs IBO ratings are usually on the low end of the scale and you could likely get a bow that exceeds that rating all done in accordance to 30" 350 grain at 70lbs.

  20. #20
    ATA is much stricter and can't be "cheated" as much. Let's look at a case study.

    Manufacturer A sticks to ATA and shoots their bow at the edge of ATA: 70.1 lbs, 30 1/4 " draw length.
    Manufacturer B goes by IBO and shoots their bow at the edge of IBO: 72 lbs, 30 3/4" draw length.

    Which do you think is going to shoot the same arrow faster? And don't you believe for even a second that the manufacturers do not go right to the edge of the spec to get the highest speed ratings. Stretching to the limits of IBO can easily result in a speed that is rated close to 10 fps faster than the equivalent ATA rating.
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtprice View Post
    Nope, someone already clarified this on another thread. ATA is 70#, 30" draw with 350 grain arrow. IBO is 30" draw with 5 grains per pound of draw weight, up to 82#. They also showed the poster of PSE's new models and they're listed as ATA/IBO with the same numbers. Hoyt is still slow.
    The above is correct. I would also like to add this

    When we speak of terms of IBO legal...we think of 5 grains per pound. ex 350 grain arrow shot at 70 lb 30 inch draw.. as being the standard or base measurement. Now lets define IBO legal.... IBO gives 2lbs for SCALE VARIANCES. Common sense. Not all scales weigh the same. This provision was implemented to give a margin of error. to reduce the number to DQ's

    What some of the bow manufactors have been done the last few years is testing a 350 grain arrow at 72lbs AND fudging on the draw length too to get the speed they want to(lie) bragg about...

    You folks that have Archers Advantage. Play with IBO specs. To obtain the IBO speed that t he program claims SHOULD be obtained for your set up, you have to input an increase of 2 pounds to the program to get the speed. and that of course is based on 30 inch draw....

    The ATA method, If I understand correctly, is intended to be more straight forward... no grey areas of extra poundage.
    IMHO...a true indicator of bow performance...instead of spreading BS to give the impression that a bow is faster than it really is... IMHO the ATA method is the HONEST way to give performance stats... the IBO legal way..(adding 2 pounds and fudging on draw) Is the POLITICIANS (liars) way of stating "facts"

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  22. #22
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    It's really easy ATA you use calibrated and certified equipment. IBO use what you have. ATA is a real standard IBO is a let's be semi close.
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  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Widgeon View Post
    ATA is much stricter and can't be "cheated" as much. Let's look at a case study.

    Manufacturer A sticks to ATA and shoots their bow at the edge of ATA: 70.1 lbs, 30 1/4 " draw length.
    Manufacturer B goes by IBO and shoots their bow at the edge of IBO: 72 lbs, 30 3/4" draw length.

    Which do you think is going to shoot the same arrow faster? And don't you believe for even a second that the manufacturers do not go right to the edge of the spec to get the highest speed ratings. Stretching to the limits of IBO can easily result in a speed that is rated close to 10 fps faster than the equivalent ATA rating.
    Is someone holding Hoyt to these standards or do they police themselves?

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by parkerbows View Post
    Is someone holding Hoyt to these standards or do they police themselves?
    No one holds any of the manufacturers to any standards. The only thing keeping them in line are consumers and some of us that do bow reviews.
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  25. #25
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    for all you that remember 252 amo speed is considered fast like 330 ibo

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