NAPs FOC broadhead

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  1. #1

    NAPs FOC broadhead

    I am new to crossbows. Just received my Tenpoint GT Flex yesterday. I have not even shot it yet....

    I am looking at either the Spitfire or the FOC. I like the big cut the FOC makes. (I am color blind and can not blood trail too well. So I like anything that will drop them in my sight.) I am wondering about the heavy weight of that FOC. How does the 170gr FOC compare to 100 gr SpitFire? I guess I am giving up some velocity/trajectory... I can live with that. Are there any other things to consider? The 170 gr just seems so unconventional. Or is it really just a bit heavier? Anyone have experience with the FOC?

    Thanks,
    HH

  2. #2
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    A bushel ... of guys advocate Spitfires and Spitfire Maxx ... I'd use one of those if it were me. Why give up 70gr worth of speed & trajectory?
    Wyvern Scorpyd Velocity165 425.5fps @ 426gr & 171KE, Zeiss 3-12 Illum Duralyt, CamX Accuspine, Slick Trick & Spitfire Wyvern Scorpyd Orion150 Leupold 2.5-8x36mm, ACUdraw. Swarovski bino. Leica rangefinder. Surefire, Fenix, Zebralight & Olight lights.
    White Buffalo Inc. - Project Manager ... Wounded Warrior - Mentor ... NRA Life Member 1971

  3. #3
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    Weight = Kenetic Energy = Penetration.
    TenPoint Venom, Black Eagle Executioners
    New Archery Products Broadheads
    Burris, Leupold Optics, Generation 3 XB30
    NRA Life Member, Molon Labe, Bravo Zulu Team VI

  4. #4
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    Speed x weight = Kinetic Energy = penetration. In my opinion investing in the weight component of Momentum/KE is only worth it when you're bumping up close to being "under-gunned" for whatever game you're hunting. Considering 25KE kills deer; any energy above about 65KE for a deer is well invested in speed rather than MORE Momentum/penetration. As is often said "just how deep in the ground do you want your arrow after the pass through?" A 65KE arrow almost always results in a pass through, so my philosophy is to use the excess energy to flatten the trajectory. Thereby increasing your chances for a clean kill if you happen to miscalculate range. I'm guessing range miscalculations lose far more deer by producing poor hits than deer being lost for lack of penetration.
    Wyvern Scorpyd Velocity165 425.5fps @ 426gr & 171KE, Zeiss 3-12 Illum Duralyt, CamX Accuspine, Slick Trick & Spitfire Wyvern Scorpyd Orion150 Leupold 2.5-8x36mm, ACUdraw. Swarovski bino. Leica rangefinder. Surefire, Fenix, Zebralight & Olight lights.
    White Buffalo Inc. - Project Manager ... Wounded Warrior - Mentor ... NRA Life Member 1971

  5. #5
    Slick Trick also has a 175 gr 4-blade fixed broadhead that would probably be a better choice, as it doesn't use up energy in expanding, and cannot fail to expand. Also keep in mind that NAP lie like rugs when they claim it's a 3" cut - measure it - it's less than 2.5".

    Having said that, a broadside or quartering away shot, if you wait for it, would likely work well with the NAP FOC.

    Is there something else to consider? Yes, the proper spining of the bolt and bolt integrity. Contact the manufacturer of your bow to find out the appropriate head weights for you bow and chosen bolts. Too much head for your bow and bolt type, then not only will they flex too much (leading to problems like inaccuracy), then can also worse case scenario, cause your bolt to crack and break during the shot while all that energy is transferred, which could injure you (and cost you money).

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnlicenseDremel View Post
    Slick Trick also has a 175 gr 4-blade fixed broadhead that would probably be a better choice, as it doesn't use up energy in expanding, and cannot fail to expand. Also keep in mind that NAP lie like rugs when they claim it's a 3" cut - measure it - it's less than 2.5".

    Having said that, a broadside or quartering away shot, if you wait for it, would likely work well with the NAP FOC.

    Is there something else to consider? Yes, the proper spining of the bolt and bolt integrity. Contact the manufacturer of your bow to find out the appropriate head weights for you bow and chosen bolts. Too much head for your bow and bolt type, then not only will they flex too much (leading to problems like inaccuracy), then can also worse case scenario, cause your bolt to crack and break during the shot while all that energy is transferred, which could injure you (and cost you money).
    The cutting diameter of the F.O.C was already very well explained in another thread in the bow hunting section. Another guy called NAP liars too. He was proven wrong, its not the width of the broadhead. The measurement is taken from the overall cutting diameter of the broadhead.
    TenPoint Venom, Black Eagle Executioners
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    NRA Life Member, Molon Labe, Bravo Zulu Team VI

  7. #7
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    Last year was my first year hunting with a crossbow so I don't have years of crossbow specific experience. That being said the
    two broadheads mentioned (Slick Trick X-bow trick and NAP FOC ) were the two heads I did use last fall taking two deer.

    The first was a large-bodied buck with the 175 gr. X-bow Trick out of a Bowtech StrykeForce. He was walking almost straight towards me when I saw that he recognized something was out of place. At slightly over 20 yards I hit him just off the center of his chest and the bolt ended up stuck in the opposite hindquarter in the hip joint. I waited a couple of hours and found him about after about 80 yards or so. Due to no exit wound it was a mediocre blood trail, but considering the physical size of the body I thought it was excellent penetration.

    The second deer was a medium size doe with the 170 gr. NAP FOC out of a Tenpoint Phantom. Broad side at thirty yards it left a big hole (both sides) and an excellent bloodtrail. The difference in the blood trails was more to do with the shot angles and the lack of the exit hole in the first deer, than the weight of the heads. With a 100 gr. head I don't know if the penetration would have been as good on the buck.

    Bottom line...Two dead deer. As long as I'm not shooting at 98 yards I like the heavy heads just fine.
    “People who drink “light” beer don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot.”

  8. #8
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    Switch the brass inserts out for aluminum inserts and the 170 grain head will give the arrow about the same weight FOC as the brass insert with a 100 grain head.
    MOON

    Super Small Recurve Crossbows - The Future of Recurve Hunting Crossbows

    ZEISS- A CLASS BEYOND GLASS

  9. #9
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    The Fed Ex girl brought me a present today. Inside the box was my new NAP F.O.C. 170 gr. along with some 125gr. Nitrons.

    I'm getting ready to do some shooting with 100gr. BloodRunners, 125gr. ThunderHeads, 125 Nitrons & the 170gr. F.O.C.'s.

    Curious to see how all of these do being shot out of my Phantom.

    Also eager to see the results of the 170gr. F.O.C.'s & the Nitrons on deer because I have never used them.
    TenPoint Venom, Black Eagle Executioners
    New Archery Products Broadheads
    Burris, Leupold Optics, Generation 3 XB30
    NRA Life Member, Molon Labe, Bravo Zulu Team VI

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Duke View Post
    Speed x weight = Kinetic Energy = penetration. In my opinion investing in the weight component of Momentum/KE is only worth it when you're bumping up close to being "under-gunned" for whatever game you're hunting. Considering 25KE kills deer; any energy above about 65KE for a deer is well invested in speed rather than MORE Momentum/penetration. As is often said "just how deep in the ground do you want your arrow after the pass through?" A 65KE arrow almost always results in a pass through, so my philosophy is to use the excess energy to flatten the trajectory. Thereby increasing your chances for a clean kill if you happen to miscalculate range. I'm guessing range miscalculations lose far more deer by producing poor hits than deer being lost for lack of penetration.
    This post should be a sticky on every archery hunting forum. I the 80's, 65 KE was adequate for elephant. That's before all the mechs though. A COC fixed head will blow through any land mammal on earth at 65 KE with a fair hit.

  11. #11
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    I shot a mature doe last year with a FOC. I was very skeptical the large cut might not produce a pass thru. She was 25yrd quartering toward me..the arrow ended up 8-10 inches buried after ripping a massive entrance and exit. She took about 5or6 bounds....stopped and looked back towards me and immediately tipped over. I will be using again in "short "yardage situations.....

  12. #12
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    Concerning forward of center, most xbow arrows have 90 or 110g inserts and 100 or 125g broadheads. So total point weight ranges from 190-235gs. A 170g FOC and a 26g AL insert = 196g which is at the lower end. I'd rather have more weight in the BH than in the insert. Total point weight below 190g results in an foc that is too low for stable xbow arrow flight at longer ranges. Using FOC bh's , AL inserts, plastic flat nocks, blazers, and 18" Zombies , my arrows weight about 397gs. To me, the 170g or 175g broadheads have their place. These arrows have enough foc to have excellent accuracy out to 100 yds(1 1/2" 3-shot groups out of my M380 and M405).

  13. #13
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    FOCs are my favorite BH's . I've killed appx 14 deer with these at ranges from 25 yds to well over 60 yds. No losses, appx half were DRT, and the others normally were down within 15 yds.

  14. #14
    I'm not a huge fan of two blade heads . But 3" is 3" and I respect the findings of members on here.
    I was looking on eBay and saw where they have Turkey heads and I guess reg or deer heads. Anyone know the difference.
    Just a down to earth Bowhunter.

  15. #15
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    I love the FOC'S 'S after seeing SEW's pictures of his kills with the FOC I decided to try it out and bought a pack. Well the first doe got about 35 yards with a massive blood trail. If I wasn't in my ground blind I would have easily seen her fall.

    Don't fear try the FOC and thanks us later. It's my favorite bh.

    Best of luck

    Brian
    Scorpyd slp165

    ALSO the NEW MEMBER to the family

    Excalibur Matrix 405 and loving it!

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by 445 supermag View Post
    I love the FOC'S 'S after seeing SEW's pictures of his kills with the FOC I decided to try it out and bought a pack. Well the first doe got about 35 yards with a massive blood trail. If I wasn't in my ground blind I would have easily seen her fall.

    Don't fear try the FOC and thanks us later. It's my favorite bh.

    Best of luck

    Brian
    Blunt question do they seem to have the same poi as field tips. I don't care to adjust my scope one bit. But from my experances with 3 blade spitfires. You can't shoot them very many times until you bend a blade trash the keepers or they open in flight.

    I have no doubt they kill and would do it fast. And I might not switch. That's going to depend on how the G5 mags do. Out of the 405.

    And do you have to band them to keep them closed

    Thanks
    Just a down to earth Bowhunter.

  17. #17
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    The head I shot a doe with seems to be as good as it was new. I put it under the hot water faucet and scrubbed the blood and mud out of the blade channels with a toothbrush,freshened the blade with a wet stone and I plan on using again. Blades seem to "snap" down in lock position just like before. I did not use any bands on it....shot out of a sz 380. It takes quite a tug on the blades to deploy them manually.

  18. #18
    Joe...they fly true with the field points they supply I have never seen a blood trail produced from any other broad head I have used in the past. ..it's never a few drops here and there it's literally a red carpet. ..and not much of a tracking job needed. If u do have a problem it's only a blade and u can get replacements. ..the head it's self are extremely durable.and no bands needed here either
    Stryker Solution LS 390, Hawke XB30, BEE 20", Lumenoks, NAP FOC Broadheads
    Excalibur Matrix 355
    Skorpyd orion extreme 175 Vortex xbr

  19. #19
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    I practice to 100 yds. FOCs are affected by indexing. I've found in general that the FOCs hit slightly lower than the fieldpoints even though the total arrow combination weight is the same. The FOC is the quietest BH I've ever used except for the Puckett of 30ish years ago. About 50% of the time they don't spin test well after use on a deer. Not all hits(M380/405) are passthru's , but every non-passthru was a DRT .

    This one with an FOC but not by me. 3 mi from my house. M380.


    This one last year. 56 yds, 12 pt, went 10 yds, point of impact

  20. #20
    Thanks very much guys.
    Just a down to earth Bowhunter.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by rt2bowhunter View Post
    Blunt question do they seem to have the same poi as field tips. I don't care to adjust my scope one bit. But from my experances with 3 blade spitfires. You can't shoot them very many times until you bend a blade trash the keepers or they open in flight.

    I have no doubt they kill and would do it fast. And I might not switch. That's going to depend on how the G5 mags do. Out of the 405.

    And do you have to band them to keep them closed

    Thanks
    They shoot pretty darn close to field points. I was able to get them to pretty much shoot POI by just rotating the cock vain and then mark it.

    I shoot them in my 405 matrix and NO I DON'T BAND AT ALL AND NO PROBLEMS WITH ACCURACY OR PREMATURE OPENING.

    Hope this helps

    Brian
    Scorpyd slp165

    ALSO the NEW MEMBER to the family

    Excalibur Matrix 405 and loving it!

  22. #22
    Thanks , Brian it helps a bunch
    Just a down to earth Bowhunter.

  23. #23
    I just placed a order
    Just a down to earth Bowhunter.

  24. #24
    how much did you find em for joe?
    Stryker Solution LS 390, Hawke XB30, BEE 20", Lumenoks, NAP FOC Broadheads
    Excalibur Matrix 355
    Skorpyd orion extreme 175 Vortex xbr

  25. #25
    Curious as well
    Mathews Chillin in Wv

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