View Poll Results: Which heads would you like to see pitted against each other in round 3?

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  • QAD Exodus 100 grain

    25 47.17%
  • Steele Force Phathead 125

    18 33.96%
  • German Kinetic

    18 33.96%
  • Ramcat 100

    14 26.42%
  • Ramcat 125

    8 15.09%
  • Slick Trick 100

    26 49.06%
  • Grizz Trick 125

    15 28.30%
  • Magnus Buzzcut

    11 20.75%
  • Magnus Stinger

    7 13.21%
  • Other - Write in vote (please post in thread)

    9 16.98%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Rage, Muzzy and Slick Trick BH Testing into Ballistic Gel Today...The results are in

  1. #101
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    Last the Slick Tricks:
    Blew through 1 plate and had significant penetration on the 2nd plate...though the 2nd plate did stop the head....after getting a big chunk blown out with blade cuts:
    Virtually ZERO damage to the head other than slightly dulled blades (much less dulling than the others). No bends, no breaks, and the tip was as new!
    slicktrick 001.jpgslicktrick 002.jpgslicktrick 003.jpgslicktrick 004.jpgslicktrick 005.jpg
    Better archery through science.
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  2. #102
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    Whitey375 and Mahly,

    Can you tell me more about your bone simulator material? For the commercial stuff what's it's name who manufactures it and why is it realistic? (Who says it's realistic?)

    Mahly, your stuff looks pretty good, and repeatability is a very nice characteristic. It also looks like it might be expensive and time-consuming to make. (Unless that's regular old particle board?) My arrows will weigh 750 grains and up, with 2-blade single-bevel heads, so I would expect to blow through at least 3 layers of the stuff with every shot. I can buy cow bones for $0.65/lb or less. Not as scientific, and not nearly as repeatable, but a reasonable expense. Also, it will be hard to hit exactly where I am aiming. I figure scapulas to start with.

    I really like the Northwoods tests with scapulas in ballistic gel, but that also looks awfully time-consuming, and I have limited time to get this done. I will start arrow tuning this weekend or next - depending on the delivery schedule for my custom broadheads - and survivability and penetration testing will begin soon afterwards. I had thought that 5/8" OSB was a pretty consistent media, then I found it varied a lot with moisture content. It is easily available and within my price range, so I may go back to it.



    There is a lot of experience here, so please do not hesitate to speak up. I do not want to steal this thread, so please respond to: http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showth...1607099&page=1


  3. #103
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    Contrary to popular belief, there is a difference between sharing knowledge and forcing your opinion.

  4. #104
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    We make stuff out of the material we use at work, so I basically get it for free ( I use ones that have a flaw (run) in the baked on coating)
    Definitely NOT OSB! Much harder, and tested for consistency. Formed under high temp and VERY high pressure.
    Don Go: it really depends on what your shooting those arrows out of. The 750gn will help, but your gonna need some serious horsepower to get through 3 plates.
    I ran the same test with a set of SteelForce heads...same arrow, same bow. basically, they stuck like a dart into the first plate...virtually breaking it in half (energy had to go somewhere, the plate was cracked from end to end!). Now the SteelForce is a very LONG head...and doesn't get to the ferrule before penetrating very deep. Methinks the chisel tips help break the bone instead of just hoping to cut the bone...if your 2 blade head of choose is very long, I don't think it's going to get through even 2 plates...the SF didn't get through 1.
    Better archery through science.
    Vectrix XL #60 31.5"
    Strother Moxie #50 31.5"
    www.carbofastdirect.com

  5. #105
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    Wow that is some test! Really like the unique material you built, it is a great new fresh idea Mahly!
    Elite Archery - Winners Choice - Muzzy - Tightspot - Gold Tip - Bee-Stinger - BowADX
    Professional Hunter & Guide - Outdoor Writer / BUNDU BOWSHOP - VRYHEID KZN

  6. #106
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    Great stuff Mahly
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  7. #107
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    Feb 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by meatmissile View Post
    Gotta love the tricks!!!
    That's why when I switched in 2005, I've never looked back!
    United Bowhunters of New Jersey
    "If it doesn't have big antlers or gobble, I don't hunt it"

  8. #108
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    Dec 2011
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    Atlanta, GA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mahly View Post
    Last the Slick Tricks:
    Blew through 1 plate and had significant penetration on the 2nd plate...though the 2nd plate did stop the head....after getting a big chunk blown out with blade cuts:
    Virtually ZERO damage to the head other than slightly dulled blades (much less dulling than the others). No bends, no breaks, and the tip was as new!
    slicktrick 001.jpgslicktrick 002.jpgslicktrick 003.jpgslicktrick 004.jpgslicktrick 005.jpg
    Mahly, if I PM'd you the address for Joel at Ballistek do you think that you could send a single 12x12 tile to him for the next gel block? If all of the above mentioned arrows blew through one tile then there is a good chance that our testing will do the same but have the advantage of measuring the further penetration into the gel afterwards for comparison purposes...I can have Joel put a flooring tile in the other end just in case we get a really deep/hard hitting head in the next round...just a thought. Perhaps this would give us a read on how a "quartering to" shoulder hit (your tile) would react given that the angle of the shot would likely produce a ribcage (my tile) exit. Brdy
    2nd Chance Archery - Obsession Archery Dealership & 4 Phase Tuning Services
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  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mahly View Post
    Don Go: it really depends on what your shooting those arrows out of. The 750gn will help, but your gonna need some serious horsepower to get through 3 plates.
    I ran the same test with a set of SteelForce heads...same arrow, same bow. basically, they stuck like a dart into the first plate...virtually breaking it in half (energy had to go somewhere, the plate was cracked from end to end!). Now the SteelForce is a very LONG head...and doesn't get to the ferrule before penetrating very deep. Methinks the chisel tips help break the bone instead of just hoping to cut the bone...if your 2 blade head of choose is very long, I don't think it's going to get through even 2 plates...the SF didn't get through 1.
    Mahly,
    What was the total arrow weight? I'm shooting 750 grain (and up) arrows and from a 29" (or 30") draw 73# 101st Airborne. (If I remember right the 29" draw gets 227 fps.) I'd sure like to give it a shot. My bh is a custom that has a moderately fat ferrule, and a 2.22:1 aspect ratio single-bevel. Same question. Can I get 3 plates?

    (No good deed ever goes unpunished!)

  10. #110
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    ttt
    2nd Chance Archery - Obsession Archery Dealership & 4 Phase Tuning Services
    Obsession Evolution...353+fps... Thump 'em Dead
    Obsession Phoenix and Sniper GT...343+fps...The Pit Vipers of hunting rigs
    Change or get left behind

  11. #111
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    Apr 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Go View Post
    Mahly,
    What was the total arrow weight? I'm shooting 750 grain (and up) arrows and from a 29" (or 30") draw 73# 101st Airborne. (If I remember right the 29" draw gets 227 fps.) I'd sure like to give it a shot. My bh is a custom that has a moderately fat ferrule, and a 2.22:1 aspect ratio single-bevel. Same question. Can I get 3 plates?

    (No good deed ever goes unpunished!)
    750 Gr arrow (and up??) What are you shooting at?? Do you know what you k/e and mo are??

    Really curious, why shoot such a heavy set up??

    Wow

  12. #112
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    Oct 2011
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    Colorado
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    My KE runs about 86 ft lbs for these heavy arrows. 752 gr gets 227 ft/sec, 86 ft-lb, momentum .613.
    I tested some 900 grain arrows on Cape Buff carcases in 2006, and they penetrated really well when they hung together. I had 6 of 24 arrows fail on the carcases, but 6 arrows (4 failures) were aimed at the scapula on purpose.

    My custom "Dauntless" broadhead design should fix the failure part! http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1730979

    I need this setup for Cape Buff in Tanzania in July, and will use it for grizzly in Alaska in Sept.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Don_Go View Post
    My KE runs about 86 ft lbs for these heavy arrows. 752 gr gets 227 ft/sec, 86 ft-lb, momentum .613.
    I tested some 900 grain arrows on Cape Buff carcases in 2006, and they penetrated really well when they hung together. I had 6 of 24 arrows fail on the carcases, but 6 arrows (4 failures) were aimed at the scapula on purpose.

    My custom "Dauntless" broadhead design should fix the failure part! http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1730979

    I need this setup for Cape Buff in Tanzania in July, and will use it for grizzly in Alaska in Sept.
    Dont forget pics IF you make it back! Lol

    Sent from my MB855 using Tapatalk
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    100 grain broadheads, total arrow weight 370 gr

  14. #114
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    British Columbia
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    were the Slick Tricks, standards, or mags? Just curious. I shoot ST Mags.
    2012 PSE Dream Season EVO;
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    Gold Tip Expedition Hunters 5575, Blazer vanes, 100 grain Slick Trick Mags and Ramcats.

  15. #115
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    se michigan
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    one thing i want to point out is you said that the slick tricks have a small cutting did. 1" in two directions is 2" of total cutting edge,thats a fair amount of blade. i shoot the mags and they absolutely wreck stuff. I also have a rage ferrule that bent over the the shoulder of an ohio buck a few years back, i will post a pic, them broadheads are not very strong.nice vid by the way

  16. #116
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    rage.jpg folded right over in the offside shoulder

  17. #117
    I have a question about the bone simulator. If you puncture the tile doesn't it crack thus making it easyer for the other heads to penatrate. You did a good test on of the better ones I've seen but that is the only thing bugging me.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverbc View Post
    were the Slick Tricks, standards, or mags? Just curious. I shoot ST Mags.
    Mags


    Quote Originally Posted by skullytheguy View Post
    I have a question about the bone simulator. If you puncture the tile doesn't it crack thus making it easyer for the other heads to penatrate. You did a good test on of the better ones I've seen but that is the only thing bugging me.
    Only if the tip of the next head hits the crack....they still gotta make their own hole.
    Better archery through science.
    Vectrix XL #60 31.5"
    Strother Moxie #50 31.5"
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  19. #119
    Could the muzzy of dived down due to hitting a crack from the other shots instead of making its own hole?

  20. #120
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    I'm thinking that was more due to a blade bending...or at least flexing a fair amount when it broke through the tile, that steered the arrow downward.
    Better archery through science.
    Vectrix XL #60 31.5"
    Strother Moxie #50 31.5"
    www.carbofastdirect.com

  21. #121
    But if it hit square then why did the one blade take that kind of punishment and not the others?

  22. #122
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    It happens. Look at my pics....each of those were into verging material
    Better archery through science.
    Vectrix XL #60 31.5"
    Strother Moxie #50 31.5"
    www.carbofastdirect.com

  23. #123
    Kind of interesting that only one blade would bend but how ever it happens it happens.

  24. #124
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    WOW, Chris from Sneaky Outdoors (mtn3531 here on AT) has been VERY generous with sample BH's for the next round of testing...He sent German Kinetics, Magnus Buzzcut and Stingers, Ramcats and an Exodus....I think that we all owe him a great big Archery Talk Thank You....I will remain objective and just film/comment on the results of all these heads but this should be one heck of a 100/125 grain shootout...I will be including the Slick Trick in the next round as well and am just waiting for some 125gr blades...

    Here is next rounds lineup...
    BH Testing Lineup April '12.jpg
    2nd Chance Archery - Obsession Archery Dealership & 4 Phase Tuning Services
    Obsession Evolution...353+fps... Thump 'em Dead
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    Change or get left behind

  25. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by brdymakr View Post
    WOW, Chris from Sneaky Outdoors (mtn3531 here on AT) has been VERY generous with sample BH's for the next round of testing...He sent German Kinetics, Magnus Buzzcut and Stingers, Ramcats and an Exodus....I think that we all owe him a great big Archery Talk Thank You....I will remain objective and just film/comment on the results of all these heads but this should be one heck of a 100/125 grain shootout...I will be including the Slick Trick in the next round as well and am just waiting for some 125gr blades...

    Here is next rounds lineup...
    BH Testing Lineup April '12.jpg

    Sweet. Can't wait for the results.



    Thanks for all of your great work!
    .

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