Page 6 of 39 FirstFirst ... 4567816 ... LastLast
Results 126 to 150 of 967

Thread: Jesus vs. Scientists: Who's Better at Miracles?

  1. #126
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Newark, Ca
    Posts
    9,839
    Quote Originally Posted by 8750 View Post
    If we didnt know how, and why, electricity works, we never would have figured out how to generate it. The egg came before the chicken on this one.
    Really? When they shot electrons through a gas cloud, part of the time the path looked like it was something with mass, and the other part it looked like a photon. We can calculate the effects of it, but can we explain how it really works?
    "Huh, dude...I think we got hit by a big boat...Hey, quit bogarting the bowl, dude...why am I wet?..." -hdracer

    Staples Sucks I Use Office Depot

  2. #127
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    colorado
    Posts
    14,945
    Quote Originally Posted by IChim2 View Post
    No one really knows when Jesus birthday is....but were supose to believe everything in the bible happened just the way it's written ?.....ok.
    how does one affect the other?
    I know you were borne, doesn't mean I know when.
    Walk Your Talk

  3. #128
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    colorado
    Posts
    14,945
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster of Xs View Post
    If they use the sunlight penetration method they'll only get the date from when the stone was cut up until the time it was buried.
    So what are you assuming here?
    Walk Your Talk

  4. #129
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    NE US
    Posts
    34,372
    Quote Originally Posted by cobowhntr View Post
    So what are you assuming here?
    Nothing besides dating those stones would show how long they were exposed. Other methods would be used to date the site through various means.
    Sent via my 1918 Bell hand crank phone

  5. #130
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    1,290
    I haven't read all the posts... but scientists perform zero miracles so Jesus wins. Lol
    And whatever y'all are talking about with gravity.... it can't be precisely explained because gravity is only a theory in the scientific community. It is simply a working fact. Evolution is also a theory, or a working fact.

  6. #131
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    NE US
    Posts
    34,372
    Quote Originally Posted by rolyat008 View Post
    I haven't read all the posts... but scientists perform zero miracles so Jesus wins. Lol
    And whatever y'all are talking about with gravity.... it can't be precisely explained because gravity is only a theory in the scientific community. It is simply a working fact. Evolution is also a theory, or a working fact.
    Exactly.

    Now can we move on to abiogenesis and get this creator nonsense out of the way? We need to get to naturalistic morally soon.
    Sent via my 1918 Bell hand crank phone

  7. #132
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    colorado
    Posts
    14,945
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster of Xs View Post
    Nothing besides dating those stones would show how long they were exposed.
    When? would they show how long they were exposed the 1st time the 2nd or the 3rd?
    The problem is that all of the other methods rely on assumptions like constant rate of decay or exposure or radiation of gases, problem is there is no such thing; each of these variables can & are influenced.
    Walk Your Talk

  8. #133
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Arden Hills, MN
    Posts
    9,752
    Quote Originally Posted by 8750 View Post
    We know exactly how electricity works. Ohms law has been proven with an error of about 10^-15 . That is more accurate than most people can even imagine. It is actually easier to believe in a "miracle" than to comprehend a number as small as 10^-15. Gravity is pretty well understood as well. If gravity was not understood then space travel and satellites would not be possible. It is not "thrown out" because the laws do not hold for speeds near or at the speed of light. It just can not be readily applied to speeds at or greater than the speed of light, the latter of which has never been witnessed. Newtonian mechanics work perfectly fine for our physical world.

    The bible was written 300 years after the death of Christ. 300 years!. How accurate do you think the bible can be?. How hard is it to get accurate history from 150 years ago? think about that.
    Try getting a group of 10 people together. one person tells the next a story and that person tells the next. The process is repeated until the final person retells the story to the first. Then compare that version with the original. This process can take at most 10 minutes if you keep the story to 1 minute. Do this and then think about how the story of the bible maintained accuracy for 300 years before the technology of writting was invented and the bible was created, by man.
    We know about the effects of gravity on objects in relation to the earth. If all it was is mass, why is it if you hang 2 different masses in space, they are not "sucked" together by their own gravity?

    Why don't fat people have midgets orbiting around them?

    We don't have a CLUE as to how gravity works. We can predict its effects here on earth, and have measured it on the moon, but we have no clue WHY it happens.
    The beginning of wisdom is admitting "I don't know"

  9. #134
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    NE US
    Posts
    34,372
    Quote Originally Posted by cobowhntr View Post
    When? would they show how long they were exposed the 1st time the 2nd or the 3rd?
    The problem is that all of the other methods rely on assumptions like constant rate of decay or exposure or radiation of gases, problem is there is no such thing; each of these variables can & are influenced.
    They aren't. You better get to reading before trying to debunk radiometric dating. Since they've only been exposed for a little over a dozen years, what would it matter? Do you think that'll skew the evidence so it's not in your favor or something? Doesn't ALL evidence show how the very basis the Bible is founded on to be untrue?
    Sent via my 1918 Bell hand crank phone

  10. #135
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    colorado
    Posts
    14,945
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster of Xs View Post
    They aren't. You better get to reading before trying to debunk radiometric dating. Since they've only been exposed for a little over a dozen years, what would it matter? Do you think that'll skew the evidence so it's not in your favor or something? Doesn't ALL evidence show how the very basis the Bible is founded on to be untrue?
    Again, I've done my study. & I'm not afraid to pit the interpretation of a scientist against the written word, never have never will(what's interesting is that you assume so even though I've repeated this before. I live with a woman that majored in biology, minored in geology & has since been degreed in physical therapy whom helped me meet Christ.) & no ALL evidence doesn't' show how the very basis of the bible is founded to be untrue. It's actually the opposite.
    Walk Your Talk

  11. #136
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    NE US
    Posts
    34,372
    Quote Originally Posted by cobowhntr View Post
    Again, I've done my study. & I'm not afraid to pit the interpretation of a scientist against the written word, never have never will. & no ALL evidence doesn't' show how the very basis of the bible is founded to be untrue. It's actually the opposite.
    You "interpret" your written word. Kettle, meet pot. You just twist it to mean whatever you like, just like the rest of the Christians of the world. Well, besides those fringe literalist crazies.
    Sent via my 1918 Bell hand crank phone

  12. #137
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Arden Hills, MN
    Posts
    9,752
    Quote Originally Posted by rolyat008 View Post
    I haven't read all the posts... but scientists perform zero miracles so Jesus wins. Lol
    And whatever y'all are talking about with gravity.... it can't be precisely explained because gravity is only a theory in the scientific community. It is simply a working fact. Evolution is also a theory, or a working fact.
    Gravity comes up because it is A) an example of a theory and B) one that we really do NOT understand, because there are some creationists (even here) try to claim the evolution is invalid because it is "just a theory".
    The beginning of wisdom is admitting "I don't know"

  13. #138
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Arden Hills, MN
    Posts
    9,752
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster of Xs View Post
    You "interpret" your written word. Kettle, meet pot. You just twist it to mean whatever you like, just like the rest of the Christians of the world. Well, besides those fringe literalist crazies.
    The beginning of wisdom is admitting "I don't know"

  14. #139
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    colorado
    Posts
    14,945
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster of Xs View Post
    You "interpret" your written word. Kettle, meet pot. You just twist it to mean whatever you like, just like the rest of the Christians of the world. Well, besides those fringe literalist crazies.
    quite true, I do interpret the written word. I also seek & study with others that do the same & rely on their input to ensure that I'm not reading into things. I'm also quite fond of offering my interpretations up to others for discussion & debate. My interest of study is the design of relationships & relationships as an apologetic discipline. I also appreciate apologetics in general.
    Walk Your Talk

  15. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by DougKMN View Post

    That's funny. You draw conclusions and then look for supporting facts just like you are now.

  16. #141
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    colorado
    Posts
    14,945
    Quote Originally Posted by DougKMN View Post
    Funny there is a whole math discipline that starts with the conclusion & the problem is figuring out how it came to be, yet you don't seem to be bothered by that scientific method.......
    seems same same.
    Walk Your Talk

  17. #142
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Arden Hills, MN
    Posts
    9,752
    Quote Originally Posted by ZenBubba View Post
    That's funny. You draw conclusions and then look for supporting facts just like you are now.
    Oh really? Provide specific examples.
    The beginning of wisdom is admitting "I don't know"

  18. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by DougKMN View Post
    Oh really? Provide specific examples.
    Reread post #140 as many times as necessary.

  19. #144
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    south east mo,Doe Run Mo.
    Posts
    10,398
    Quote Originally Posted by cobowhntr View Post
    how does one affect the other?
    I know you were borne, doesn't mean I know when.
    But if they can't get his BD right...why believe that everything else is true.My birthday is not important and will never go down in history.Surely someone could have chissled it into thier stone tablet.

  20. #145
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    1,290
    The only thing more unrealistic than creationism is the big bang theory... now that's a joke! Lol
    Creationism is more valid in my mind than any theory scientist have come up with to explain the beginning of the "universe."



  21. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by IChim2 View Post
    But if they can't get his BD right...why believe that everything else is true.My birthday is not important and will never go down in history.Surely someone could have chissled it into thier stone tablet.
    Not every birth was recorded in the US 100 years ago.

  22. #147
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    colorado
    Posts
    14,945
    Quote Originally Posted by IChim2 View Post
    But if they can't get his BD right...why believe that everything else is true.My birthday is not important and will never go down in history.Surely someone could have chissled it into thier stone tablet.
    If you study the bible concerning the person of Christ we have lots of info regarding his personage but nothing that would lead us to worship graven images. does that make sense? Basically look at how much emphasis is placed on Easter rather than living like you really believe He's real(our church was packed today, why not next week? or in 30 days? The teaching & Sunday school will actually be more "practical or hands on" why not come then if you want to really get something out of it?).
    Also if you look at that time, He was made know to a few but largely overlooked till his ministry was to begin(my time has not yet come, mother) also he was being hunted at his birth or as a child due to His significance so it makes sense that his birth date is a bit of a mystery. What's really important, that we know the day He was born or that he WAS born? Which do you think would be important to God the father & what do you think mankind would do with such a date? I personally believe it would be idol-ed rather than celebrated. Which is why we don't even know what Christ looked like. The truly important details are made known the ones we would like stumble over(idolize) are left out.

    But again not knowing a date doesn't make the information provided false.
    Walk Your Talk

  23. #148
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    NE US
    Posts
    34,372
    Quote Originally Posted by cobowhntr View Post
    quite true, I do interpret the written word. I also seek & study with others that do the same & rely on their input to ensure that I'm not reading into things. I'm also quite fond of offering my interpretations up to others for discussion & debate. My interest of study is the design of relationships & relationships as an apologetic discipline. I also appreciate apologetics in general.
    Interpretation is the definition of r"eading into things"!!

    The whole point here is that if you aren't a whacko literalist, and I know for sure you aren't, then your take on your theology is just simply made up. It either says it in the Bible or it doesn't. Interpretation is ridiculous! What good is a document that needs interpreted?
    Sent via my 1918 Bell hand crank phone

  24. #149
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    1,290
    The human mind simply can not interpret the universe. Ask yourself "Why?" enough times and you will eventually run out of answers. There are things out there that are far superior to us. How do we know we weren't created by something superior? Who we call God.

    I am by no means an expert on the Bible... but does it not say somewhere in there that we rose from the dirt? Does that not sound like what we call evolution?
    Science and religion don't have to contradict each other. Its all about how you view it. Science gives answers religion doesn't, and religion gives answers science can not.

  25. #150
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    colorado
    Posts
    14,945
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster of Xs View Post
    Interpretation is the definition of r"eading into things"!!

    The whole point here is that if you aren't a whacko literalist, and I know for sure you aren't, then your take on your theology is just simply made up. It either says it in the Bible or it doesn't. Interpretation is ridiculous! What good is a document that needs interpreted?
    interpretation is simply the act or process of interpreting(explaining the meaning of); elucidation.
    I explain what I mean all the time to my kids & wife, to clients or people that I'm in dialogue with. (who is our neighbor) which of course leads to an elucidation as to the significance of that explanation.

    You aren't working that noggin of yours & you are building poorly designed straw-men.
    If for no other reason it needs interpretation due to the language issue. We interpret the Constitutional all the time, in fact they just had a pretty major case argued so as to seek constitutional interpretation & that document is written in English. IDK, what good is that document??

    My take on theology isn't made up anymore than my interpretation of the my speed needing to be appropriate to the driving conditions at hand while remaining within the confines of the posted speed limit which requires observation/interpretation of the conditions at hand.

    I agree that it either says it or it doesn't, not sure what you're getting at with that?
    Walk Your Talk

Page 6 of 39 FirstFirst ... 4567816 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •