a href="http://www.lancasterarchery.com/archery-classic-register/#header">
Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: Can you dry fire a bow with an Arrow on the string?

  1. #1

    Question Can you dry fire a bow with an Arrow on the string?

    I am new to archery and recently purchased a Bear Encounter. Yesterday I was shooting for the first time, I have it set to 50lb draw and it is a little difficult (have to build some muscle) but after shooting for awhile I had shot where I pulled back and released the string with an arrow. The bow essentially dry fired, the string came off the Cam (but still captured in the bow itself) and went limp and the arrow went nowhere.

    The bow doesn't appear damaged (though I'm not expert, I am going to take a cu-tip and look for cracks but I couldn't see anything with my eye) and I have a shop looking at it.



    I'm just trying to understand what happened.

    Is it possible that maybe (because I was tired and haven't trained with the bow much) poor form could lead to this happening?

    The only thing that I can come up with is maybe I didn't have the string pulled straight back and had it at an angle so that when I released it the force was off center and the string hit the bow as opposed to being allowed to fire the arrow.

    Does this sound plausible? Other scenarios?

    I think I understand the proper way to draw and everything, I think I just made a really big noob mistake. I'm just hoping it doesn't cost me. Live and learn I guess.


  2. #2
    Might be the death grip. Do you let the grip float against your palm, or do you close your fingers around it? If you close your hand on the grip, you can "torque" the bow, or twist it so the string is no longer in line with the groove on the cams, then it can derail. Could really be a number of other things too, I'm not familiar with the "Bear Encounter".
    If it's got moving parts, I'm interested.
    Current gear:
    Mathews Monster XLR8 70lbs.
    High Country Archery X-Treme 70lbs.
    Bowtech RPM360 72lbs. "birth" weight. Currently just below that.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    13,318
    Do you shoot off a D-Loop?

    Was the nock on the arrow damaged?
    I shoot bows. All kinds of bows.

    My opinions are MY OPINIONS. Take them for what they are worth.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Mississauga ON
    Posts
    9,053
    If you had an arrow nocked, even if the string came off the bow due to torque, the arrow should have gone forward. I suspect you either cracked the arrow nock, or the arrow came off the string just before releasing.

  5. #5
    Form would not matter if the nock was on the string properly. Is the nock damaged or broken? If you are putting your release under the nock without a button between the nock and release it is possible for the string angle to let the nock come off if your getting tired or your form is bad. Like others have asked, d-loop or off the string? It does matter.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    318
    Also may want to consider that many archers tend to use their index finger as an "arrow guide" while drawing...have seen many people inadvertantly pull the arrow off the string, and at times unknowingly.

  7. #7
    Having the nock not properly nocked could cause a dry fire. As someone said torquing the bow could cause you to derail but not dryfire. The arrow would still take off.
    2013 Elite Hunter 30in draw 72#, HHA OL5500, QAD Ultra HDx, Victory Vap V1 .300
    Helix Broadheads

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Lagrange, Indiana
    Posts
    76
    you might have cracked your arrow a previous shot, i had this happen. make sure your cams are still in sync with each other

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Houston (not many know Katy)
    Posts
    9,176
    arrow not fully nocked is probably the answer. If you drew the bow, then let down, the arrow could have slipped forward a little. You go to fire again, then BAM...dry fire. The string jumps the nock.

    If you're shooting a bow that has an axle to axle length of shorter than 40" and you were using fingers, no release aid, you could have had too much nock pinch effectively pulling the arrow off the string as you release.
    USA Level 2 Instructor
    2012 PSE Supra ME, 47#,ACC, Davis sight;2012 Dominator Pro 3D 55#; DS Advantage; ACC's
    Win-Win Inno Carbon Riser/Tropics 36#(38 tof), Redline arrows 690- DS Advantage-282grn@ 195fps
    2010 Hoyt Vantage Pro, XT 2000, Sprls, Sure Loc W BE 6X, ACC's 408g @ 259

  10. #10
    Yeah, I think you guys are right. I can't say I remember exactly what happened but it seems that the arrow must have come off the nock. Well I guess I'll be extra paranoid about that in the future. Darn, well hopefully everything is alright. I have to say, even with the little shooting I've done it is a lot of fun.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Central Arkansas
    Posts
    1,360
    Quote Originally Posted by Bombdiggity View Post
    Also may want to consider that many archers tend to use their index finger as an "arrow guide" while drawing...have seen many people inadvertantly pull the arrow off the string, and at times unknowingly.
    X2. I have seen this happen, also. NOT GOOD!
    Shut up and shoot!
    Genesis 27:3

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Morinville Alberta
    Posts
    634
    possable derail .. buy a pratice hook release ,, impossable to dry fir that should also help keep the string on the cams ,, good luck don't give up,,

  13. #13
    Is a derail basically equal to a dry fire in damage to a bow?

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Houston (not many know Katy)
    Posts
    9,176
    As to damage, it could bend the cam or bend the axle
    USA Level 2 Instructor
    2012 PSE Supra ME, 47#,ACC, Davis sight;2012 Dominator Pro 3D 55#; DS Advantage; ACC's
    Win-Win Inno Carbon Riser/Tropics 36#(38 tof), Redline arrows 690- DS Advantage-282grn@ 195fps
    2010 Hoyt Vantage Pro, XT 2000, Sprls, Sure Loc W BE 6X, ACC's 408g @ 259

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    2,072
    Yes, had a guy I know did it to a Mathews and broke a limb, he thinks it fell off prior to the shot, he was a novice, still is in my mind

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Appleton, WI
    Posts
    13
    were you using a release? did fatigue cause you to actually let it down quickly and not release?


  17. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    172
    You mentioned you're having a shop look at it so I'd pay attention to what they say, as opposed to a Q tip.
    It probably needs to be placed on a draw board to check for limb fractures. A derail can happen at any time during pull or release so it's not always as bad as a dry fire, which is full compression and full extension.
    Any number of things could have happened to contribute to the accident. When you're tired torquing can happen much easier because you're gripping the bow harder to pull back. I'm assuming you were using a release. I've been shooting since the mid 80's without an issue but when I bought my allegiance in 08 I dry fired it 4 days after buying it, and I was just plain stupid because I put my finger over the release without an arrow nocked at all. The string crept a bit and as I pulled back I punched the release without thinking. I should have known better.
    Bow was ok but it woke me up and I'm sure you'll know better as well.
    Good luck with it and nice to see another shooter getting into the sport.

  18. #18
    No, fatigue did not cause that. That would have been really over worked then--no just theorizing that maybe I had bad form--I don't really think that is what it was though--I really do think it was the arrow not being attached.

  19. #19

    Can you dry fire a bow with an Arrow on the string?

    Sound like the arrow came off the nocking point.


    PSE EVO 7 !

  20. #20
    God decided to smile on me. The pro shop said as best they can tell there was no damage other than the peep sight flying off (and going who knows where).he also gave me some pointers on firing it in the future. I think I will use the release for sure now, just have to get use to not using my fingers. I got a book from the library today on archery, should help me to learn to do everything properly.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    3,256
    Quote Originally Posted by Bombdiggity View Post
    Also may want to consider that many archers tend to use their index finger as an "arrow guide" while drawing...have seen many people inadvertantly pull the arrow off the string, and at times unknowingly.
    You do NOT want to do this. It will become a habit, then it comes time to hunt and the broadhead could cut the heck out of your finger.
    MATHEWS CHILLR Lost

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Houston (not many know Katy)
    Posts
    9,176
    shot with fingers? That bow is way too short to be shot with fingers. Most likely what happened was "Nock pinch". With the narrow string angle, the string will pushed/squeeze your fingers onto the nock of the arrow. When this happens you'll end up pushing the arrow off the string as it rolled from the finger tips (archers paradox)...just a guess.

    Archers paradox? what happens to the arrow/string as it's released. When you release with fingers you get the string rolling off the fingers. As this happens the string does not take a straight path behind the arrow but rather an arc (actually a snake-sign wave) from the release point. The string leaves the finger tips at an angle towards the shooter then back across the opposite side, crossing the center line of the initial intended line of the arrow, then back to center.

    If that nock is not completely seated on the string, the arrow will jump the nock due to this arcing motion.

    here is a little video showing what I'm talking about
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGNsl...eature=related
    USA Level 2 Instructor
    2012 PSE Supra ME, 47#,ACC, Davis sight;2012 Dominator Pro 3D 55#; DS Advantage; ACC's
    Win-Win Inno Carbon Riser/Tropics 36#(38 tof), Redline arrows 690- DS Advantage-282grn@ 195fps
    2010 Hoyt Vantage Pro, XT 2000, Sprls, Sure Loc W BE 6X, ACC's 408g @ 259

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Fury90flier View Post
    shot with fingers? That bow is way too short to be shot with fingers. Most likely what happened was "Nock pinch". With the narrow string angle, the string will pushed/squeeze your fingers onto the nock of the arrow. When this happens you'll end up pushing the arrow off the string as it rolled from the finger tips (archers paradox)...just a guess.

    Archers paradox? what happens to the arrow/string as it's released. When you release with fingers you get the string rolling off the fingers. As this happens the string does not take a straight path behind the arrow but rather an arc (actually a snake-sign wave) from the release point. The string leaves the finger tips at an angle towards the shooter then back across the opposite side, crossing the center line of the initial intended line of the arrow, then back to center.

    If that nock is not completely seated on the string, the arrow will jump the nock due to this arcing motion.

    here is a little video showing what I'm talking about
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGNsl...eature=related
    wow. Yeah don't want to do that.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    6,277
    Quote Originally Posted by Stash View Post
    If you had an arrow nocked, even if the string came off the bow due to torque, the arrow should have gone forward. I suspect you either cracked the arrow nock, or the arrow came off the string just before releasing.
    I've seen that a number of times with new archers (kids). You have to make sure the nock "clicks" into place on the string. Plus, as was mentioned, the finger shooting with a short ATA bow wasn't a good idea.

  25. #25
    Yep. Not a dry fire. You probably pulled the string away from it's straight-back "plane" and it popped the cams. Similar to a dry fire, but not the same. It can cause damage (may or may not)....slightly less likely to cause damage than a true dry fire; you just have to inspect the parts carefully (string and limbs mainly), and if everything is ok, but it back together.

    Or as mentioned, you may have had the arrow come off the string prematurely.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •