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Tuning question on Anarch HC.

4K views 30 replies 5 participants last post by  ZuluWhiskeyFox 
#1 ·
I have an Anarch HC 2014. I recently had a go tuning this thing. It's my first compound. So all is very new to me. I made a Bar Clamp Press that works very well for string changes and such. If ever I need to completely disassemble the bow I fear there won't be enough travel in my makeshift press. So far that has not been an issue. I have been reading Nuts and Bolts. I have arrow rest and nock height set such that the arrow is square to the string. Both cam draw stops touch at the same time. Now here is where it gets a bit funky. In order to get a bareshaft flying straight I had to adjust the limb bolts. Adjusting the limb bolts was the only way I could get a straight bareshaft arrow flight while keeping the timing in sync. Nuts and Bolts talks about this as one of the methods of achieving upper and lower limbs to balance their work load. So I got the bareshafts to fly and land right. Thing is is the upper limb bolt is bottomed out while the lower limb bolt is out about three turns. The bow is shooting better than it ever has. It just looks a little odd. What do y'all think? Am I missing something? Has anyone else experienced this?
Someone is sure ask about draw weight, length, arrow spine etc.
-Draw weight 48 lbs
-Draw length 28 inches
-arrows are Carbon Express Blue Streak 150, cut to 29-3/4"
-tips weigh 50gr. So total arrow weight is 285gr.
 
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#4 ·
I'm thinking what I really need is a draw board and check nock travel. So far my groups are the tightest they have ever been. I have also noticed a sizeable increase in arrow speed. My tuning efforts have given me about 20fps.
As for fletch contact... My rest is a limb driver. I had my wife film the arrow rest during a release. We used my iPhone 5s. It has a slow motion mode. It is not quite enough to get clear pics. However, there is some blurred imagery that shows the rest down before the fletch arrival.
 
#5 ·
Most hybrid cam systems will tune best with the top draw stop hitting a little before the bottom stop. The HC is no exception. It allows for a firmer back wall and it takes care of some nock travel. You should not have to have the limb bolts 3 full turns different.

The reason you have to have the bottom limb turned out so far is because you have the nock point to low. Put it at 1/8" high and start tuning again with the limb bolts tight and the top stop hitting 1/8" before the bottom.
 
#6 ·
You said you're using a limbriver rest, these are really hard to tune for bareshafts....
I had one on my HC too and the bareshafts were always high and nock low.
Then I put a blade rest on and had absolutely no issues with tuning, bareshaft flight what so ever
When your bottom limb is turned out 3 full turns and the upper one is maxed out I woluld definitely correct this cause this a huge difference.
As said before try with nockpopint 1/8 high and the top cam hit a bit before the bottom one - this should give you best results.
 
#8 ·
Keep the ideas coming. So far I have tried all of the above. The LD I'm using is the Micro Elite. In the beginning I had some left right issues as well. My form was definitely the issue there. With it staying up longer there is little room for forgiveness. Now that I have that one figured out I can steer left or right at will. It's still the up down that has me baffled. Last night at the range I drilled a hole through the butt at 20 yds. So it's shooting straight. But for those limb bolts?
 
#11 ·
OK. Try adjusting the spring tension on the rest stiffer and see if it helps. After that.....IDK without having the bow in hand. I've set up and tuned 4 HC's and no problems other than one that I had a brain fart and had the limb deflections in the wrong place. LOL.
 
#13 ·
You put the nock point 1/8" high and advanced the top cam 1/8"? There is no reason that you should have to have the limb bolts different by 3 full turns on that bow.

You don't happen to have a lot of heal pressure on your grip do you? Unless you some how have different limb deflections, you shouldn't be having this problem if you've tried setting it up like we described.
 
#15 ·
The quick and easy of limb deflection is the poundage of the limbs. It takes a higher deflection limb to achieve higher draw weights. If your bottom limbs are some how higher deflections than the top, that could cause this problem. However the chances of that happening are VERY VERY small. Limbs are matched in sets and then put on the bows with the entire set. It would be hard to get that different of deflection limbs on the same bow unless the shop that sold it did something shady.
 
#17 ·
Ok so I've set both limb bolts exactly 2 turns out, top cam is 1/8" ahead, nock raised 1/8".
Result at 14 yds is point of impact is the same, bare shaft is nock low about an inch. Is the nock low something I should be trying to address or is point of impact the end all and be all?
 
#19 ·
I would do all of these 3 things.

Take 1 full twist out of each yoke leg on the buss cable. You could take a half twist out of the bottom of the buss but I don't like to do that because a lot of half twists in and out will bend and flex your serving back and forth and can loosen it. Shoot and see how it reacts.

If it's still nock low, move the nock point up 1/16" and shoot again and see how it reacts.

If it's still nock low, move the rest down 1/16" and shoot again and see how it reacts.

On a side note, can you post pics of your D-loop set up and maybe one of you at full draw so we can see your anchor? I have a strange feeling that you may need a tied nock point under your nock and that you have one only on top. Just a guess though.
 
#21 ·
I agree and I think it's great that you can see that yourself. Most people won't accept or admit that they may need to go shorter. I'd drop 1" and see how that goes. Make sure you don't bend your bow arm more to get to your same posture and anchor position otherwise the DL change will not be effective. Also work on moving your torso toward the target and your hips back a bit so that you're standing with your shoulders directly above your hips.

Your loop looks a little tight to me. I know that the bow is a longer ATA than most out there today so you typically don't have to worry as much about nock pinch but it's always better to err on the side of caution. I'd loosen that bottom knot and tie in a 1/8" nock point below your nock. Make sure you leave a small gap between the nock and the tied nock point. I usually use .014 diameter serving for tied nock points and I leave about two thicknesses of serving for a gap. If you do have any nock pinch, that will take care of it. Here's a good picture tutorial of a great way to tie nock points. http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2075841

It also helps when if you need to replace your loop to get it back in the same spot each time.
 
#24 ·
3 lines that tell a lot. The yellow line is vertical through the top of your head, the red line is vertical through the center of your hips, and the blue line is vertical through the center of your feet. All 3 lines should be on top of one another.
Shoulder Leg Hiking equipment Trekking pole Metal


It will take a full body weight shift toward your front foot and also a torso tip toward the target. It'll probably end up requiring a shorter DL too. Luckily you have a bow that adjusts easily with rotating mods.
 
#26 ·
Ok. I struggled with that shorter draw length. I find that in order to get the string back to my face I need to bend my bow arm more. I also come to another conclusion. Without holding a bow I naturally stand leaning a bit that same direction. A number of factors are at work here. First, nobody's back is perfectly straight, we all have one leg longer than the other. Albeit these variations are usually slight. To further complicate things I have a lifetime of wrecks. Bicycle wrecks, snowmobile, motor cycle, horse, falling from roof of the house, all of these wrecks have taken their toll on my back. It's actually a wonder I'm still walking. So no small wonder I'm a little off kilter.
All that to say I have put 1/2" back into draw length. Now at 27-1/2" DL. At 70" wingspan that calculates to 28” DL using the wingspan over 2.5 formula. I'm going to try this DL for a while. I find so far though that I tire out sooner with this shorter DL.

The suggested adjustments to nock height and arrow rest height have made a big difference. Bare shafts are flying straight and landing the same as fletched arrows. My limb bolts are back to being even. I'm a little confused by this though as having the arrow so un-square from the bow string goes against what I read from Nuts and Bolts.
 
#28 ·
If you have old injuries and need to modify the classic "T" form to shoot comfortably, by all means do so. The "T" position is just a neutral position that most people have the most success in. Some people, most notably a world champ by the name of Reo Wilde, find that a little different form is best for them. It's all about getting comfortable and shooting your best. Whatever that takes, do it. That said, if you look at a fella like Reo, he may lean back a little but he has all the same "artifacts" that you want in a well aligned form. He has his release forearm in line with the arrow, the front edge of the arrow nock lands under his eye and his release forearm is parallel or a little "elbow high" of parallel with his arrow (you don't want elbow low).

The wingspan method isn't very accurate for a lot of people. That's partly because it takes into account the length of your hand and fingers which have nothing to do with your DL. It's more accurate to stand with your back against the wall, hold your left arm out to the side and measure from the center of your sternum to the crease where you wrist and hand meet. That's typically pretty close.

Nuts&Bolts PDF is a great document. It gets a person familiar with the basics. That's pretty much where it ends. Setting the nock height at 90deg works only some bows and is only a starting point even for those bows. Bows with dual cams like the OverDrive Binary cams that come on Bowtechs bows is one example and some binary cams like what's on Elite and their clones is another. Those bows sometimes do tune best with the arrow at 90deg to the string. A hybrid and single cam system with very rarely tune nock level. Because of this, experience tells us that 1/8" high is a good starting point for these bows.
 
#27 ·
I just orered a new Anarchy HC and it should arrive tomorrow, so I find this thread very interesting. There is obviously a lot of factors to consider when setting up a bow and I'm learning a lot. Good luck WhiskeyZuluFox, I'm anxious to know how this turns out for you.
 
#30 ·
Right and left looks good. How do you see your sights? Do you have a good peep diameter to sight diameter so that you can line up the circle within a circle? At 50 meters, if you don't have the sight housing centered in your peep the same every time, you can "walk" the POI up and down pretty easily.

You could also need to do a creep tune. Creep tuning is designed to get your arrows to land on the same horizontal plane even if you pull more or less into the wall each shot. It's done by adjustments to the cables to find the sweet spot for your cam timing.

To creep tune, do this.

Put a piece of masking tape on your target parallel to the ground and at shoulder height. Step back to wherever your first pin is zeroed and fire 3-5 normal shots at that horizontal line. If you make a bad shot or punch the trigger, throw those shots out. We want to see where your good shots are landing. Now fire 3-5 shots at the line but this time pull a little harder into the back wall. 2-3lbs of added pressure should be good and remember to take just the good shots. If you need to shoot more than 5 shots go ahead. Just get a good sense of where the good shots are landing.

If the harder pulled shots hit higher than the normal shots, add a twist to your control cable and reshoot in the same way you just did. If they hit lower, add a twist to your buss cable.

If you find that 1 whole twist on either cable is too much, use the yoke legs and take 1 or add 1 full twist to each. This will keep your cam lean but will make a smaller adjustment than 1 full twist in the bottom of the buss.

When you find the sweet spot, your normal and hard shots will hit on the same plane.
 
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