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Thread: Like talking to a wall.

  1. #1
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    Like talking to a wall.

    In a discussion I had recently, a point came up over the possibility of a raise in the office.

    The person I was talking to was livid and upset that raises had not gone forth but other expenditures had. (new vehicles, new equipment, new computers, etc.)
    During this discussion, I asked the question of this person if they knew the total tax revenue that the county was bringing in.

    They responded no.
    I then tried diligently to explain what happens when, under one mandate by the County Commission our Op. budget has to have at least 50% of a given number at the end of the fiscal year.

    I then tried to explain the total expenditures and the total income stream, (much like a business) that if we go over a certain amount, we lose money.

    The only thing they could see was the lower level raise they got, and why we didn’t get a 5%, 6% or 7% raise like other counties.



    I tried again to explain why.

    And people wonder why this nation is in such financial trouble.
    "Im a Dapper Dan man"


  2. #2
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    Kinda depends if the new vehicles, etc. are really needed doesn't it? If they are buying stuff just to spend their allotted budget and not giving raises, it would piss me off as well.

    As a taxpayer I'd rather my money went to giving people raises vs getting brand spanking new decked out police cruisers when the "old" cruisers are only a few years old. OTOH if the police are still rolling around in crown vics, then yeah they should probably upgrade.

  3. #3
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    98% of the populace wears blinders...if it doesn't directly affect them, it's not an issue..if it DOES directly affect them, watch out!
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  4. #4
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    wouldn't need new anything if you didn't have employee's they are what makes company etc... being your most valuable asset i feel they should take precedence over new pc's / vehicles / and equipment etc... like buying a new saddle instead of shoe's for the horse imo... inflation goes up and wages stay is problem with country atm imo. bet bossman gets his raise to compensate for the inflation sadly.
    2009 Matthew's Reezen 6.5, 72#-29" , fixed single pin, NO peep sight
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  5. #5
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    When you look at certain variables especially within county, state, parish, municipal, regional, etc gov. expenditures are directed by statute and law, with some amount of discretionary capabilities.

    What most miss however is that some monies are directed in only ONE direction and cannot be used for any other purpose.

    recently the County Commission allowed for a 3% raise.
    OK great.
    But then had a 7% increase in the amount an employee had to have deducted for HC insurance.

    So the actual diff. made was only about 40% of the raise ave.
    (Math wise: think about 11 bucks a paycheck for most Co. workers.)

    remember we are also at the mercy of property tax income, county taxes and various other fees and taxes that are limited in their scope and amount collected.
    That goes to a general fund and the end result typically is that the money is siphoned off for Co. Ops before it ever reaches a paycheck level.

    Also consider that if tax revenue drops, there is not enough to cover expenses. And unlike the morons in DC, County Gov. in NM especially and the State Const. dictates a balanced budget. We cannot by statute operate in the red.
    if that does happen, the revenue has to be increased or expenses (usually employees) dropped.
    "Im a Dapper Dan man"

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soocom1 View Post
    In a discussion I had recently, a point came up over the possibility of a raise in the office.

    The person I was talking to was livid and upset that raises had not gone forth but other expenditures had. (new vehicles, new equipment, new computers, etc.)
    During this discussion, I asked the question of this person if they knew the total tax revenue that the county was bringing in.

    They responded no.
    I then tried diligently to explain what happens when, under one mandate by the County Commission our Op. budget has to have at least 50% of a given number at the end of the fiscal year.

    I then tried to explain the total expenditures and the total income stream, (much like a business) that if we go over a certain amount, we lose money.

    The only thing they could see was the lower level raise they got, and why we didn’t get a 5%, 6% or 7% raise like other counties.

    I tried again to explain why.

    And people wonder why this nation is in such financial trouble.
    I'm confident they understood what you were saying. The negative responses would be their way of applying pressure. The squeeky wheel gets the grease, so to speak.
    "'Where the tree of knowledge stands, there is always paradise': thus speak the oldest and the youngest serpents."

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spreggy View Post
    I'm confident they understood what you were saying. The negative responses would be their way of applying pressure. The squeeky wheel gets the grease, so to speak.
    I have absolutely zero control over budget.

    But actually
    Spregg, I don't think they do understand those aspects.. They are complaining without understanding why its not happening.

    Remember, were at the mercy of the taxes collected.
    "Im a Dapper Dan man"

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soocom1 View Post
    I have absolutely zero control over budget.

    But actually
    Spregg, I don't think they do understand those aspects.. They are complaining without understanding why its not happening.

    Remember, were at the mercy of the taxes collected.
    My field is very dependent upon taxes, and thankfully so. It's the only steady check out there during a recession. Either way, they know you're funneling it to your offshore account in the Caymans.
    "'Where the tree of knowledge stands, there is always paradise': thus speak the oldest and the youngest serpents."

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by booger View Post
    Kinda depends if the new vehicles, etc. are really needed doesn't it? If they are buying stuff just to spend their allotted budget and not giving raises, it would piss me off as well.

    As a taxpayer I'd rather my money went to giving people raises vs getting brand spanking new decked out police cruisers when the "old" cruisers are only a few years old. OTOH if the police are still rolling around in crown vics, then yeah they should probably upgrade.
    Heh. "Crown Vics", he says. Our County finally got funds this year to replace the aged "fleet" (I use that term loosely) of Ford Broncos and Chevy Caprices. Not all of them were the "aerodynamic" version....

    (there was a mishmash of other vehicles in there as well - including a few Hondas and Nissans, an Intrepid, and probably a few Crown Vics - none of them were painted in any "Official Colors" until this year with the new Chargers)
    Parfois, on fait pas semblant!
    (Sometimes, it is not pretend!)

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soocom1 View Post
    When you look at certain variables especially within county, state, parish, municipal, regional, etc gov. expenditures are directed by statute and law, with some amount of discretionary capabilities.

    What most miss however is that some monies are directed in only ONE direction and cannot be used for any other purpose.

    recently the County Commission allowed for a 3% raise.
    OK great.
    But then had a 7% increase in the amount an employee had to have deducted for HC insurance.

    So the actual diff. made was only about 40% of the raise ave.
    (Math wise: think about 11 bucks a paycheck for most Co. workers.)

    remember we are also at the mercy of property tax income, county taxes and various other fees and taxes that are limited in their scope and amount collected.
    That goes to a general fund and the end result typically is that the money is siphoned off for Co. Ops before it ever reaches a paycheck level.

    Also consider that if tax revenue drops, there is not enough to cover expenses. And unlike the morons in DC, County Gov. in NM especially and the State Const. dictates a balanced budget. We cannot by statute operate in the red.
    if that does happen, the revenue has to be increased or expenses (usually employees) dropped.
    all it takes is a reassessment of the budget at the next board/ commissioners meeting.

  11. #11
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    Too bad they aint in a union. If they were, big raises would be jammed down the counties throat despite tax revenue.
    Hunting: 10% skill and 90% location.

  12. #12
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    And why not reinvest that money in the economy instead of depreciating assets?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbrunson View Post
    And why not reinvest that money in the economy instead of depreciating assets?
    Here is an interesting point that plays into the vehicle thing.


    The county is 3500 sq. miles in size. ALOT of rural areas to traverse and because of the Fed. and Tribal land between population centers, the travel can be long and argerous on the vehicles.
    keep in mind most of our vehicles are of the early 2000 vintage with about one exception and yes, even a 2001 Crown Vic in the mix.

    The state mandates a re-appraisal either on a one, two or three year cycle. This so to keep values current. This means a lot of travel time and use of vehicles that can rack up 150-200 K miles a year. ALOT of use and abuse.

    Not like police cars, but in some cases worse when you have a person with no 4x4 experience driving to a rural area to assess new construction, or the reappraisal crew driving through mountain roads to get to a house, building etc.

    But there are other issues as well outside that.

    The purpose of the post however is to point out that in many cases people only look at specific numbers without understanding the whole of the budget or the mechanisms in place that make it work.

    They only see numbers and wonder why they cant get some of it.
    "Im a Dapper Dan man"

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by treetops View Post
    98% of the populace wears blinders...if it doesn't directly affect them, it's not an issue..if it DOES directly affect them, watch out!
    Seen this a lot over the past fews years here in Wisconsin. It's sort of funny to watch teachers act worst than the kids they are supposed to teach.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by intheshaw View Post
    Seen this a lot over the past fews years here in Wisconsin. It's sort of funny to watch teachers act worst than the kids they are supposed to teach.
    Or have our own elected officials hide in Illinois to avoid a vote...
    "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." - JFK

    "Anything in life worth doing, is worth overdoing...Moderation is for cowards." Shane Patton, Lone Survivor

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbrunson View Post
    And why not reinvest that money in the economy instead of depreciating assets?
    because not enough people pay attention to local politics.
    Walk Your Talk

  17. #17
    This only shows that when the Debt crisis hits the people hooked up to the spigot will be the ones rioting. See Detroit, 50% of their budget went to pensions until they no longer could pay, bankrupt. Govt only consumes the fruits of other peoples labor.
    Tell those whiners to go get a private sector job that actually produces something and get off the gravy train.



  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soocom1 View Post
    In a discussion I had recently, a point came up over the possibility of a raise in the office.

    The person I was talking to was livid and upset that raises had not gone forth but other expenditures had. (new vehicles, new equipment, new computers, etc.)
    During this discussion, I asked the question of this person if they knew the total tax revenue that the county was bringing in.

    They responded no.
    I then tried diligently to explain what happens when, under one mandate by the County Commission our Op. budget has to have at least 50% of a given number at the end of the fiscal year.

    I then tried to explain the total expenditures and the total income stream, (much like a business) that if we go over a certain amount, we lose money.

    The only thing they could see was the lower level raise they got, and why we didn’t get a 5%, 6% or 7% raise like other counties.

    I tried again to explain why.

    And people wonder why this nation is in such financial trouble.
    Dont they usually put this person in charge of answering the phones? seems like thats the kind of people I always get, talking to a wall,
    Boomer Sooner

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by cobowhntr View Post
    because not enough people pay attention to local politics.
    Money paid locally is money spent locally. (for the most part)

    Granted, if the equipment is worn out, it needs replaced. Same with the workers.

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