what is the real reason for a HIT insert? like is there any advantage? also why dont the make inserts for "x" sized arrows (fmj, axis) with a lip on the outside like a regular insert? and why are the only ones like that deep six?
Why HIT inserts?
gusty
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I don't believe Easton is headed in a different direction by adding a larger diameter FMJ shaft that takes a standard H insert and has a shoulder, but it does give those of you that don't believe in the HIT insert an option. Why don't other manufacturers use the HIT system? I'm sure it's a patent issue. Collars, used by other manufacturers, that fit over their narrow shaft, on either end, get around that patent and allow the use of standard points and prevent the splitting of the shaft, but that's "old school" like the original Beman Carbon shafts.
I don't agree with anything stated here. I've NEVER seen an Axis shaft with a bend in it! It's no different than most any other carbon arrow...it'll break, but NOT bend.
As far as concentricity is concerned, the arrow is going to have WAY higher tolerances than Aluminum inserts that are spit out by the thousands, and RARELY checked for its concentricity...if ever.
I'll stick with Axis arrows as long as they're made also! Unless they're hit with another arrow, or smack into something VERY hard, I see no reason they won't last, nearly, indefinitely! I have some that have been shot countless times and will continue until Robin Hooded!
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I like HITs too, haven't had a single issue over the past 7-8 years.. And the people that say half outs are stronger and have better foc are full of it bc I've seen plenty of bent steel half outs but HITs can't bend.. And as for foc the brass HITs are 75 grains where as most steel half outs are 50 grains.. Plus if having a "lip" concerns people the BARs are cheap and do the same thing as any inserts that covers the end of the arrow
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Well A Pro Shop that sells a Lot of Easton Small Diameter arrows and installs the SO Great HIT well they start getting "Pushed Back in the Shaft" on the FMJ's had 4 of them do that here at AT I was told you can get them out Wrong Tried several small stiff steel rods and never got one Out! For 118.00 for the FMJ's I will go back to my main hunting Arrow though no longer Made XX75 2514. I see no advantage to Small Diameter Shaft Arrows for Major of Hunters they don't shoot but maybe 30 yards so wind is not going to make any different and I have always got a "complete pass thru" and the deer piles up with 60 yards of where I have taken the shot! So it is just a "Fade" to make archers think smaller is better just like the Deep Six being it is small with more possibility to broke being only 6/32 size and not the Old Standard 8/32 which large is stronger having more material. And yes Pro Shop that is an "Easton Dealer" should also know how to install these but when some have the HIT Come loose that is more likely why the OP was asking is there and really unless you get "Lucky" you are out the $ for the shafts as I was!!! The So Call Pro Shop did not stand behind their work and having 4 HIT come loose not worth the money when you can get other arrows that can do a better job having a Collar to protect the tip end of the arrow shaft... Will never Buy another Easton Arrow that uses the HIT, glad some think they are so good but not worth the Money never had to deal with any Insert coming loose in any Gold Tip, Carbon Express or a Easton XX75 arrows, and they all have a collar on the outside. And to Cut the shaft shorter makes them too short for my draw to use any insert that has a half in / out insert as mentioned that so use. only way to get the Special Adhesive removed to cut the shaft shorter...
Glad some think they are so good but not for all otherwise why do some use something other than the HIT!!! Must be a reason!!!
Oh ya I heard that they use the wrong adhesive, or they set the arrow in the wrong position and so on but again the Pro Shop sold many arrows and installed the HIT's in them so guess I was just unlucky to have them come out...
LFM
Glad some think they are so good but not for all otherwise why do some use something other than the HIT!!! Must be a reason!!!
Oh ya I heard that they use the wrong adhesive, or they set the arrow in the wrong position and so on but again the Pro Shop sold many arrows and installed the HIT's in them so guess I was just unlucky to have them come out...
LFM
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Amazing disparity among reports...I'm planning on shooting Axis this year, hope it's not the nightmare some report.
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I am setting up 6 of the kenetic KAOS arrows with the HIT inserts. We shall see how they spin and how durable they are. Thanks
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Axis shafts are a great hunting shaft, I have used them for a long time and see no reason to change for hunting. They are a good balance of weight to diameter and very cost effective.
The HIT insert is great as well, they alliign straighter than any other insert I have used with carbon arrows. I use the brass 75-50 grain HIT inserts and even put them in with blue hot melt. With 0 issues.
If I miss had hit something hard that arrow is demoted to a Judo arrow so my expectations might be different that yours.
The HIT insert is great as well, they alliign straighter than any other insert I have used with carbon arrows. I use the brass 75-50 grain HIT inserts and even put them in with blue hot melt. With 0 issues.
If I miss had hit something hard that arrow is demoted to a Judo arrow so my expectations might be different that yours.
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32,452 Posts
You just stated above that you couldn't get them out. So which is it......did they come out or not? Sounds like a hack job for installation, I don't care how many they've done. Don't blame the HIT's.....blame the person that installed them. They're actually real easy to install, yet at the same time real easy to screw them up if you do it wrong.
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541 Posts
If the inside of the shafts aren't cleaned after they are cut with denatured alcohol then maybe the epoxy couldn't bond to the best of it's ability. Also, there are tools that even Easton makes that etch the inside of the shaft to rough it up to give the adhesive more to grip. Both of these steps can be incorporated to mitigate HIT insert slippage.
Easton Arrow Preparation Kit (9 Piece) on Amazon
Easton Arrow Preparation Kit (9 Piece) on Amazon
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1,236 Posts
Right, no special tools are really even needed... Qtip with alcohol to clean inside shaft, mix epoxy they give you, put epoxy on end of HIT, twist it in, set depth with little green tool provided, and let rest horizontally or a while.. It's not hard but a dummy could screw it up.. That's why I ALWAYS put my own inserts in.. If a shop glues them in and then stands them up in the corner to dry, they are probably gonna slide inside the shaft and not be the correct depth... So how is that the inserts fault? Common Sense is the Key lol...
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497 Posts
CaptJock is dead on. Easton's HIT is currently the strongest system for narrow shafts. This is because of the much higher strength to weight ratio of carbon. I mean, that's why we're all shooting it....it takes a beating. I shoot axis and kinetics both, and still prefer the HIT over the half in, half out set ups because they only end up adding inaccuracy and weakness, at least, as far as current efforts go. I've tried the ballistic collars, half out's, victory VAPs.
The weakness to HITs, if there is one, is only that the shaft is not stabilized at impact regarding outward neck expansion. This is where Kevlar/Aramid fibers work BEST. I simply wrap the ends of my shafts in 24lb test, spider wire in a single spiral for half the length of the insert and back over itself once and set it with epoxy. The HIT allows the shoulder of the shaft itself, (stronger than virtually any insert system regarding impact scenarios) to take the "HIT" and the tight kevlar line prevents any splits from starting.
HITs all the way for narrow shafts!
TS
The weakness to HITs, if there is one, is only that the shaft is not stabilized at impact regarding outward neck expansion. This is where Kevlar/Aramid fibers work BEST. I simply wrap the ends of my shafts in 24lb test, spider wire in a single spiral for half the length of the insert and back over itself once and set it with epoxy. The HIT allows the shoulder of the shaft itself, (stronger than virtually any insert system regarding impact scenarios) to take the "HIT" and the tight kevlar line prevents any splits from starting.
HITs all the way for narrow shafts!
TS
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2,298 Posts
I have the ability to bend destroy anthing. I'm Even bending normal inserts bent two ferrules this year as well aluminum just cant stand up to heavy impacts over 300fps close to 500gr. Going heavy foc is about the only way to avoid it.
So hits especially the brass are nice to have.
So hits especially the brass are nice to have.
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38,933 Posts
Obviously you don't fully understand how difficult it is to mix PROVIDED 2-part epoxy on a paper plate with a toothpick, smear a bit on the end of the HIT, install about half way and wipe off excess, push the rest of the way into the shaft with the PROVIDED tool.....then lay flat for curing. This is so challenging and arcane that some "pro" shops can screw it up. The rare, talented and highly skilled among us are able to READ the INSTRUCTION in order to accomplish such a momentus task.....and actually have the HITs stay in the right place. :set1_thinking::dontknow:
i read the instructions for this momentus tasl and still messed them up. maybe im just dumb but when i would install them, the tool would pull the insert back out. i couldnt really avoid it. i even used 2 different tools so i would have a clean one.
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1,696 Posts
I disagree that you think the half out is stronger. The Hit insert is glued to more of the inside of the shaft than the half out, that's how they gain their strength. As far as the hit insert not having a lip on it, it is no different having the field point butt up against the carbon to drive against it than having an insert butt up against it to drive against. With the half out there is more point/insert in front of the carbon and less inside the shaft giving it more leverage to break the arrow and or bend the insert. I have personally tested both styles and I bent several of the half outs and pulled 1 hit insert out which turned out it didn't get glued well, and I just glued it back in. An arrow builder recommends the half out's, it is because they are included. They have to buy HIT inserts for the rampage's which in turn comes off their bottom line... As far as the better FOC better flight statement, You can use the brass HIT insert and have the same outcome as the stainless half out.
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