I was watching Levi Morgans video on how a bow naturally spins an arrow. My bow shoots a bare shaft and spins to the left. So i will be doing a left offset. My question is will it shoots any bare shaft with a left spin or will that change with different spine arrows. I assume all would be the same since it the bow causing the natural spin but thought i would check to be sure.
An arrows natural spin from bow
Xringindy
21 - 40 of 78 Posts
Joined
·
1,656 Posts
If he's not good enough to tell the difference, why am I even reading this thread?
Was wondering how it affected arrow if you use straight fletch, but never mind
Joined
·
20,941 Posts
Has anybody done any testing with the difference in aluminum versus carbon have the same exact spine... both static and dynamic?
What about the direction of the carbon wrap?
What about the direction of the carbon wrap?
An earlier poster already called it but it has to do with how your center serving is wrapped not anything else.
Joined
·
711 Posts
OP pm'ed
Sent from my LG-H871 using Tapatalk
Sent from my LG-H871 using Tapatalk
Joined
·
20,941 Posts
That doesn't explain why I've had bare shaft spin both directions... kind of mood since I fletch straight anyway
How much are they spinning? If it's less than a 1/4 turn at 20 feet then it could just be the heavy side of the arrow for all we know. Not all of the bows I checked had a definite spin, and the ones that did usually turned 1/2 to 3/4 a turn at 20 feet in a consistent direction.
Joined
·
79 Posts
Has anyone tried different d loop configurations and its effect on arrow rotation?
Joined
·
4,648 Posts
When I get to a level almost as good as Levi then I’ll worry about it and pass him! Lol Until then, he’s safe from me.
Between myself and a friend that's a tech at a local shop, we've "clocked" well over 100 different bows and only once have we seen an BS that didn't rotate opposite the string twist direction, and that was corrected by fixing the extreme nock pinch that existed on the bow. I tie my D-loops the opposite direction of what's commonly regarded as the "correct" way. It's not handed-ness, nor D-loop direction, nor arrow material composition that determines BS rotation direction, it's the string twist direction (which dictates the serving direction) that is the primary controlling factor.
Does it make a difference? YES, often it does.
Is it enough for an average archer/bowhunter to "worry" about? Probably not.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UP9FDh6oOmo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7d9J3kMS3l0
Joined
·
20,941 Posts
I didn't really do much in-depth testing, just check to see direction of Spin and amount on a few arrows of each type that I had. Definitely could have been heaviside rotation but I would think since they respond indexed based off shot results that that would not be the case
As to degree of rotation... The ones that rotated clockwise. Maybe 120 to 140 degrees while CCW was maybe 90.
Joined
·
9,730 Posts
Here is an in-depth thread I started serval years ago on this subject. Check it out, there might be some more information that might help some of you. My findings for my set up is on page 4 I believe, and I used three different arrows & 3 different knocks , all the same result.
https://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2190007
https://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2190007
Joined
·
38,240 Posts
The Post that started this natural rotation stuff - https://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=4014881&p=1091415185#post1091415185
Enlarge picture - read paragraph at bottom of 2nd column. I like the part of "even shot out of the same bow." You're going fletch your arrows how? How many times you going to check after you change something? The Pros might (I said Might) see a difference - For the vast majority of archers, no..........
I going to fletch my arrows any dang way I want.....Where the Hell is my Card?
I tested this thing, even posted results. Use any arrow and you will get varying results. Nestly stated something for his arrows and I gave of my arrows - two different arrows, probably spine, speed and whatever differences and we got different results. Yep, the so-called "natural" spin showing for both of us. I had 1/2 rotation at 11 feet for the bare shaft, which ain't showing much power to arrow. For my fletched arrow - Started out counter clockwise and started clockwise before 9 feet. Another 12 feet had the arrow make darn near a full revolution clockwise. Thacker's own statement said I was wasting my time............
Best advise given;
"B3AV3R
If you subscribe to the "go with the natural spin" theory, fletch them that way. If you subscribe to the "it's good to go against the natural spin" theory, fletch them that way.
It may or may not matter, either way, but the confidence gained from doing what you believe will help your shooting will actually help your shooting."
Enlarge picture - read paragraph at bottom of 2nd column. I like the part of "even shot out of the same bow." You're going fletch your arrows how? How many times you going to check after you change something? The Pros might (I said Might) see a difference - For the vast majority of archers, no..........
I going to fletch my arrows any dang way I want.....Where the Hell is my Card?
I tested this thing, even posted results. Use any arrow and you will get varying results. Nestly stated something for his arrows and I gave of my arrows - two different arrows, probably spine, speed and whatever differences and we got different results. Yep, the so-called "natural" spin showing for both of us. I had 1/2 rotation at 11 feet for the bare shaft, which ain't showing much power to arrow. For my fletched arrow - Started out counter clockwise and started clockwise before 9 feet. Another 12 feet had the arrow make darn near a full revolution clockwise. Thacker's own statement said I was wasting my time............
Best advise given;
"B3AV3R
If you subscribe to the "go with the natural spin" theory, fletch them that way. If you subscribe to the "it's good to go against the natural spin" theory, fletch them that way.
It may or may not matter, either way, but the confidence gained from doing what you believe will help your shooting will actually help your shooting."
Attachments
Joined
·
1,277 Posts
We've been stacking deer like cordwood 4 years with equipment that is both great and even equipment that is not so great from years ago. Arrow spin issues are just a made-up problem just to get video content out there.
That post from 2016 is not what "started" it, there are multiple page topics about natural rotation direction long before that, including the 2014 post that Kevin linked, and in fact there is record of this discussion happening in the 1970's by some very recognizable archers (ie Frank Pearson).
Pics of one arrow in a target, or even pics of 3 arrows mean nothing. Can someone shoot 1 arrow fletched "backward" into the center? Absolutely! Can they shoot 3 into the middle? Absolutely! Can someone win a high level accuracy competition against other high level archers while shooting arrows fletched "backward" Not likely. Nobody is suggesting that fletching backward, or fletching the "wrong" direction will result in failure, the point of these discussions are to increase success and accuracy, and to that point they are not a waste of time for those who have that goal. I have done a fair amount of "testing" in the area of natural rotation direction and there are some facts, patterns, and differences when fletching "with" vs "against" the natural rotation direction. Fletching direction absolutely does make a difference in how the arrow reacts in the first portion of free flight, and that does have an affect on where the arrow impacts down range. Whether that difference is large enough for the archer to notice depends on a lot of factors, including the consistency of the archer. Fletching the "wrong" direction is not ever going to cause a failure, but fletching the direction that works best with a particular setup may result in greater success than shooting fletchings that are applied without consideration for which way they spin the arrow.
Joined
·
38,240 Posts
May; might, not sure........You yourself said proof would have to come from testing over varying distances which would be a bunch of testing and it would have to be more than "couple" of times......I doubt 20 yards because we've had shooters shoot 30Xs on the Vegas face. Edit; And with thin to thick arrows with every kind of fletching, vanes or feathers...
Joined
·
38,240 Posts
I joined AT in 2006. Never have I seen "clocking" a subject so heated since the Lancaster Post of 2016.
Hard pressed to find any right helical/offset among these guys.
http://bowjunky.com/male-pro-2nd-half-animal-round-2019-nfaa-outdoor-nationals/
And it so happens Donny Thacker (Mr. Clocker himself) would have cleaned the animal round in his first ever Outdoor Nats had he not shot the wrong target....very impressive.
Not saying clocking is for everyone, or that it will help everyone. Obviously, that is not the case. But it is currently trending in pro divisions. I think it's worth a try if you are serious about target archery, and not worth the trouble is you are a normal hunter/backyard shooter/AT pro.
http://bowjunky.com/male-pro-2nd-half-animal-round-2019-nfaa-outdoor-nationals/
And it so happens Donny Thacker (Mr. Clocker himself) would have cleaned the animal round in his first ever Outdoor Nats had he not shot the wrong target....very impressive.
Not saying clocking is for everyone, or that it will help everyone. Obviously, that is not the case. But it is currently trending in pro divisions. I think it's worth a try if you are serious about target archery, and not worth the trouble is you are a normal hunter/backyard shooter/AT pro.
Joined
·
4,561 Posts
I am intrigued by many topics like this and I like learning about new things, I had never thought about an arrow having a natural rotation, and I do have some questions.
If you rotate an arrow opposite its natural rotation what is the major problem and will it have any effect at all on the average archer / bow hunter, or is it one of those things like trying to weigh the difference in fly poop and pepper? I fully realise top competitors must learn and take advantage of everything they can to win, even though many of the same principles that apply to my car apply to race cars, the race car is built to a higher standard because the way it is used, so, is this kinda the same thing?
Thanks.
If you rotate an arrow opposite its natural rotation what is the major problem and will it have any effect at all on the average archer / bow hunter, or is it one of those things like trying to weigh the difference in fly poop and pepper? I fully realise top competitors must learn and take advantage of everything they can to win, even though many of the same principles that apply to my car apply to race cars, the race car is built to a higher standard because the way it is used, so, is this kinda the same thing?
Thanks.
21 - 40 of 78 Posts
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
