What is the best way to determine how much wind will affect the arrow? Do you throw some grass up in the air or watch the clouds and give it x inches to compensate? Is there a yardage or wind ratio you use? I would imagine at some point it's a feel thing to some degree, but on longer shots the wind can have an impact and just wondering how folks approach it.
Wind compensation
jons7e
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What is the best way to determine how much wind will affect the arrow? Do you throw some grass up in the air or watch the clouds and give it x inches to compensate? Is there a yardage or wind ratio you use? I would imagine at some point it's a feel thing to some degree, but on longer shots the wind can have an impact and just wondering how folks approach it.
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Interested in this one as well on what people have to offer
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Two ways. Aim off, or bubble into the wind.
Like field14 used to say, practice in the rain to see how rain affects your shot.
Practice in a cross wind, to see how a cross wind affects your shot.
When shooting field archery, shoot toes up on a side hill, to see how it affects your shot.
When shooting field archery, shoot toes down on a side hill, to see how it affects your shot.
So, how much will a cross wind affect my 90 meter shot (100 yards)?
So, how much will a cross wind affect my 50 meter shot?
So, how much will a cross wind affect my 40 yd, 30 yd, 20 yd shots?
Is the wind gusting?
Are you gonna wait in between wind gusts?
Have you learned how to read the wind (like the long range rifle shooters...1000 yards). Trees, bushes, grass.
How is the cross wind (you have to gauge the wind speed) at the shooting line?
How is the cross wind (you have to gauge the wind speed) at the target? Matters more for the long shots (90 meters),
which is about 100 yrds.
If you are shooting Easton X10 ProTours, with tungsten points (about $650 for a dozen arrows),
these arrows are very skinny, and SUPER dense, and are designed to fight a cross wind (need to aim off much less).
Are you shooting a super fat 27/64ths arrow? Massive outside diameter, means lousy cross wind resistance.
There are no shortcuts. Practice, practice, and practice some more.
Keep a log book for your findings.
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Hybrid construction arrows (aluminum core with carbon exterior), in the super skinny outside diameter
will do the best in a cross wind, cuz they are heavier per inch, and usually tiny outside diameter.
Cartel Triples
Easton X10
Easton X10 ProTour
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Practice. Growing up in Nebraska, the wind bows every. single. day. of. your. life. Shooting in the wind is a skill that's developed just by doing it. You can use calculations and theory all you want to determine approximately how far an arrow will be blown off course in the wind but you won't know until you just do it. You also need to learn how to control a bow in the wind and to execute your shot. Most people that shoot very poorly in the wind aren't doing so because they can't figure out how to hold off the spot a bit. It's mostly because they don't ever practice shooting in the wind and aren't ready to deal with how the wind affects their body/bow while shooting.
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I practice in wind up to 20 mph. Gusts beyond that, I don't shoot or wait for it to die back down some. Having helical fletching, at least 3°, helps stabilize arrows in flight, making impact points more consistent, at different wind speeds. I now shoot Victory VAPs and VAP TKOs, which definitely have less wind drift than other larger diameter arrows I've ever shot. In general, heavier, small diameter arrows are less affected by wind than lighter, larger diameter arrows. Yet, there has to be an optimal balance of speed, total arrow aerodynamic physical displacement area, along with mass weight, for an arrow to shoot well in wind.
I don't see how there could be standards or rules for shooting in wind. There are too many individual variables--arrow speeds, arrow weights, diameters, arrow build differences.
The only thing I know is to practice, learn and remember my own Kentucky windage adjustments, given different wind conditions, using the same equipment consistently. And to know my limitations.
Maybe some western tournament archers will chime in. I know, in some places, a lot of outdoor tournaments don't get cancelled due to wind.
I don't see how there could be standards or rules for shooting in wind. There are too many individual variables--arrow speeds, arrow weights, diameters, arrow build differences.
The only thing I know is to practice, learn and remember my own Kentucky windage adjustments, given different wind conditions, using the same equipment consistently. And to know my limitations.
Maybe some western tournament archers will chime in. I know, in some places, a lot of outdoor tournaments don't get cancelled due to wind.
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I would imagine a consistent wind isn't bad, but gusts and swirling winds, I guess there's no choice but to wait for a better time... if you can.
Trying to relate this to other sports I do in the wind, it would seem that looking for areas that both block and gather wind should be a consideration.
Trying to relate this to other sports I do in the wind, it would seem that looking for areas that both block and gather wind should be a consideration.
A couple of weeks ago it was really windy, I forget the speed, and i was shooting 60 yards at the range, mainly to see what would happen. I found that with my micro diameter heavy arrows, deep impact 525 grain, there was minimal effect on arrow flight. I did find a huge effect on my bow though. I found it very difficult to hold on target for any extended length of time. I think this is really just something that has to be tried to appreciate.
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I was out on Lancaster's website the other day looking at Brady's list and saw the tungsten tips. Then, when I saw the price just about fell over. I shoot Carbon Ones as the X10's are just a bit out of my price range, and doubt they'd give me that much of an improvement.
As to shooting in the wind, it's really just learning to read the conditions as you mentioned: trees, grass and dust across the field. Also, some places might put flags out that you'll want to learn to read. As others have mentioned, the bow is typically catching most of the wind. I've had to draw down sometimes. Others, just hold a couple of seconds longer to see if the wind cycles down a bit.
Logging is critical
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Well, you can add all the states west of the Mississippi to the list. :-(
There's shooting in the wind at targets, and shooting in the wind at game animals. Try the target part first, then decide if the wind at a game animal is worth the risk. And then there is the distance to deal with. 30-40yds with a fast arrow is not a huge challenge, at rubber deer or spots, but the combined effects of arrow speed, arrow surface area, BH size, etc. make a heavy crosswind a get closer decision, or wait for another day.
Tough call.
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In the wind the arrow isn’t the problem. The problem is the wind blowing you and your bow. You need to teach yourself to hold longer if required. This includes learning to continue breathing as you shoot. In some instances you may want to remove your stabilzers because they amplify the effects of the wind on the bow. For this to be effective you have to spend some time learning to shoot without stabilizers. Especially with a high power lens the look is very different.
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I have.....had a flag on my practice range. Windy, but no real effect on the arrow. Sure effected me. Let down so many times I couldn't count. Flag settles, shoot.
Shot Outdoor target years back. Flags on top the targets. Hey, 60, 50 and 40 yards in wind do wonders for your temperament.
Okay, you don't French tune when it's windy, not when using 50 yards down range. Wind was howling. So I bare shaft tuned. Paper tuned for best (6, 8 and 10 feet) with a bare shaft and then moved outside, 10 and 15 yards had bare shaft and fletched slapping, so went with just bare shaft until 20 yards.
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Shot Outdoor target years back. Flags on top the targets. Hey, 60, 50 and 40 yards in wind do wonders for your temperament.
Okay, you don't French tune when it's windy, not when using 50 yards down range. Wind was howling. So I bare shaft tuned. Paper tuned for best (6, 8 and 10 feet) with a bare shaft and then moved outside, 10 and 15 yards had bare shaft and fletched slapping, so went with just bare shaft until 20 yards.
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Ok, I’ll be the guy everyone disagrees with. It doesn’t matter how thick your arrow is or how heavy it is unless these factors impact arrow speed. How much an arrow drifts depends on how long it’s in the air. After the arrow is released it moves with the air column. The faster arrow spends less time drifting with the air column than a slower arrow and therefore needs less wind correction. It’s like two boats crossing a river; ones a canoe, ones an oil tanker. If they start at the same point and both travel at 5 mph, they will land at the exact same point on the opposite shore. On the other hand, if the canoe is faster than the tanker, it will be exposed to the current for less time and not drift as far downstream.
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Short answer...nope.
Boats (hydrodynamics) have a ZERO FOC. You trim a boat, when going forwards, for level forwards motion.
Don't want a boat heavy on the bow, don't want the bow heavy on the stern. This is true for super tankers, this is true for container ships.
Arrows fly better with some amount of FOC. For long distance shooting (field archery out to 80 yards), World Archery events out to 70 meters (about 76 yards)...FOC somewhere between 12-15% will work nicely.
How much an arrow drifts, is dependent on the cross sectional area of the arrow shaft. Think of a sail. BIG sails catch more wind. TINY sails catch less wind. Easton X10 ProTours are very small outside diameter, so the cross sectional area is TINY. GoldTip Triple X arrows are 27/64ths in outside diameter, so the cross sectional area is HUGE (length of arrow shaft x diameter of arrow shaft).
Easton X10 ProTours in 325 spine, are 14/64ths outside diameter. So, 325 spine Easton X10 ProTours are HALF the diameter of the GoldTip Triple X arrows (fat carbon shafts, max outside diameter). So, if you have GoldTip Triples a
29-inches shaft length, and you have Easton X10 ProTours at 325 spine, the ProTours are HALF the cross wind, cross-sectional area. SAME cross wind, SAME arrow speed (adjust the draw weight, to get the exact same speed, for both arrows), the FAT arrows will have TWICE the drag (push force) from the cross wind, cuz the "SAIL" is twice as large.
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While speed is one factor to decreasing wind drift, only because it decreases the amount of time the arrow is in the air, it's definitely not the most important factor. Shoot an arrow that's heavy enough and even though it'll be EXTREMELY slow, the wind may not have enough force to move it at all. If I shoot a piece of rebar that weighs 5lbs and there's a 10mph cross wind, that wind isn't going to be forceful enough to move that rebar hardly at all, even if it's traveling 100fps. If I shoot a drinking straw that weighs 0.3oz at 1000fps, that 10mph cross wind will still have a HUGE affect on that straw.
If you have two arrows of identical weight, same speed, but one is 3x the diameter, the increased surface area will allow any wind to act on it more than the smaller arrow. It's just extremely basic physics.
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I give up. How you load a boat makes zero difference on drift at a given speed. If it’s traveling at 5 miles per hour it will drift down stream more than a boat traveling 6 miles per hour. How you load a boat will certainly impact how much energy it takes to move it at 5 mph. Tuning is huge but it’s speed that is important relative to amount of drift. An arrow shot out of a poorly tuned bow that’s traveling @ 220 FPS will drift less than one shot out of a well tuned bow @ 170 FPS.
And nuts and bolts I have great respect for you and have followed your tuning advice for year, but your sail theory is not a good one because the sail is not a part of the air column like an arrow. It’s attached to the water through the boat.
A poorly tuned arrow with high drag will slow faster but it makes little difference over a 30 yard shot. It’s a much different story at impact where a poorly tuned arrow will have poor penetration.
Hunt and ski, your wrong about the physics and your not alone. I thought the same way before taking an aerodynamics course or two. Once the arrow is released it becomes part of the air column and there is no side drag. Buy a birthday balloon. Hold it by the string in a cross wind. The ballon will hover off to one side with the string angling back to your hand. The angled string represents the ballon’s drag while anchored. Now let go of the sting. The string will hang straight down because the balloon and string have become part of the air column and there is no drag from the wind. An arrow will still have parasitic drag as it moves forward. This drag is the same in calm air as it is in a crosswind.
And nuts and bolts I have great respect for you and have followed your tuning advice for year, but your sail theory is not a good one because the sail is not a part of the air column like an arrow. It’s attached to the water through the boat.
A poorly tuned arrow with high drag will slow faster but it makes little difference over a 30 yard shot. It’s a much different story at impact where a poorly tuned arrow will have poor penetration.
Hunt and ski, your wrong about the physics and your not alone. I thought the same way before taking an aerodynamics course or two. Once the arrow is released it becomes part of the air column and there is no side drag. Buy a birthday balloon. Hold it by the string in a cross wind. The ballon will hover off to one side with the string angling back to your hand. The angled string represents the ballon’s drag while anchored. Now let go of the sting. The string will hang straight down because the balloon and string have become part of the air column and there is no drag from the wind. An arrow will still have parasitic drag as it moves forward. This drag is the same in calm air as it is in a crosswind.
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I think you're wrong....
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