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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
We hunters are our own worse enemy.

Everyday I hear from hunters, I don’t like high fence, I don’t like spot and stalk, I don’t like varmint calling, I don’t like stand hunting, I don’t like muzzleloaders, I don’t like crossbows, I don’t like compound bows, I don’t like exotic hunting, I don’t like baiting, I don’t like tree stands, I don’t like tower stands, I don’t like ground blinds, I don’t like trophy hunting; the list goes on and on.

When are we all, going to realize that any type or style of hunting is good?

Why is it so difficult for each of us to understand, that by taking a stand against one type of hunting or another, simply because we don’t understand it or have never experienced it, or just didn’t like it, is negative to all hunting.

Ok, you say; I saw it on T.V. and it didn’t look like fair chase.

I’ve been on a T.V. hunt and I’ll tell you they are, for the most part based loosely on the truth. What you see is the final edited version, the hunt I was on was a Pronghorn hunt in West Texas the ranch we hunted was 23,000 acres. The hunt consisted of glassing 15 or 20 bucks over two days, until we found the “one” then the stalk began. My friend who is actually, the one in the “kill scene” worked this animal for over three hours before getting into range (40 yards). All of this was condensed to 15 minutes for T.V. including background and narration by the host, who wasn’t there. My point is you cannot form a subjective and knowledgeable opinion strictly by watching a “show” on T. V.

I could go on and on about this, however I won’t. Just think about it, if you promote the banning of a legal type of hunting and by legal, I mean legal anywhere, not just in your area, what will be left. Each of us have some type or style of hunting we don’t think is ethical, or fair, or right, and that is a privilege I support.
For all of our sakes If you don’t agree with it just don’t do it; please don’t bash it, or support the banning of it.


Your favorite might be next….
 

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Nicely said,we must all stand together!!:)
 

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If I follow your logic, than I should support all forms of killing (notice I did not say hunting). Just because something is "legal" doesn't make it ethical. I refuse to be "lumped" in with others who pursue activities that casts aspersions on ALL hunters. The high fence issue comes to mind. I do not want non-hunters to think that "hunters" find this acceptable. To me, this is killing, not hunting.

If we did not have rules and regulations (and social mores), than there would be zero wildlife left. Please do not try to tell me what I can support and what I can't!

Dan
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
One Eye...

If I get your point it is "YOUR" way or the highway.... am I correct?

In another post you stated that you had the right to voice your opinion.... does that not go both ways?

Or is it your football and you're going home..?

See it is irrational statements like yours that feed the ANTI's...
 

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Great post Javelina.Too bad one eye doesn't get it.Looks like he may be one of the "my way or the hiway"guys.He said "If we did not have rules and regulations (and social mores), than there would be zero wildlife left. Please do not try to tell me what I can support and what I can't!"I think being within the rules and regulations would meet what you meant by legal types of hunting..as to the second part,there is a difference in telling him what he COULD support and what he SHOULD support.Looks like another closed elitist mind.Too bad.We ALL need to stick together!
 

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There are two ways that we can hurt the sport:

1) Degrade other hunters for failing to comply with "our" ideas on what constitutes an ethical hunt.

2) Failure to police ourselves, and prosecute outlaws, because we are afraid of bad press.


People in different areas have different ideas on hunting. Don't fight it! That is what makes our country so great!
Trying to impose uniform ethics standards on all hunters is not only immpossible, but no one would like the end result. Diversity only makes us stronger!

If we want to help protect the sport, lets make sure and prosecute the guys who are breaking the established game laws, they are the ones who bring us all down. Not the guys(and gals) legally enjoying the outdoors.
 

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Support Hunting

Okay guys,

I copied the following letter from an Anti-Hunting website. It is a letter written to a congressman asking him to support a bill that would stop bear baiting on public lands. I have highlighted the parts of the letter that should concern you as a hunter.

Letter to Legislators Concerning Bear Baiting

Wildlife Watch Inc.

Helping People, Environment, and Wildlife
PO BOX 562, NEW PALTZ, NY 12561

Voice: (845) 256-1400; Fax: (845) 622-7999

e-mail: [email protected]

Contact: Joe Miele, Vice President 201-368-8271

The Honorable Peter T. King
New York-3rd, Republican
436 Cannon HOB
Washington, DC 20515-3203

6/5/03

Dear Congressman King:

Wildlife Watch, Inc. is a New Paltz, New York based animal protection group that seeks to educate the public about the mismanagement of wildlife by state and federal wildlife agencies and the destruction of wildlife and ecosystems in the name of sport hunting and game management.

On behalf of our nation-wide base of supporters, we urge you to cosponsor the Gallegly-Moran bill, HR1472, the "Don't Feed the Bears Act." This important piece of legislation will ban the irresponsible and cowardly practice of bear baiting on federal lands.

Perhaps you are not aware of the practice of bear baiting. Bear baiting is a way in which hunters lure bears toward their location so they can shoot them from point-blank range. Many times hunters will construct bait piles comprised of donuts and bagels, pizza and table scraps, in order to attract hungry bears to a spot where they will be easily killed. Many hunters condemn this sort of practice because it belies the notion of "fair chase" that many hunters view as a requirement for an "ethical hunt."
While we do not believe in the existence of an "ethical hunt" we do agree with those hunters who condemn the practice of bear baiting.

This barbaric practice is legal in just one-third of the twenty-seven states that allow bear hunting, and should not be permitted to take place on federal land. When the facts of this practice are reviewed, it is clear that HR1472 is a bill worthy of support. We urge you to sign on as a co-sponsor of HR1472 and to urge your colleagues in Congress to do the same. If you have any questions regarding bear baiting or the need to pass HR1472 into law, please do not hesitate to give us a call.

Your reply to this most important matter will be greatly appreciated.

Sincerely,

Joe Miele



The first statement is using hunters comments as ammunition to stop a form of hunting.

The second statement shows that the group does not support any hunting.

Where do they get the ammunition to make a statement like this to a congressman? In forums like this one!! When a hunter condemns another form of hunting, the Anti-hunting groups will use hunters against hunters(and have). As most can see from their comments, they don't want to stop bear baiting, they want to stop hunting. They will take what they can, call it a victory, and move on to the next battle. They are looking at the outcome of the war not the outcome of the battle. We, as hunters, look at the outcome of the battle, not the war. Some hunters think "So what, I didn't like bear baiting anyway. I am an ethical hunter and nobody will come after my form of hunting." Well folks, these groups don't care what way you hunt!!! They don't consider you ethical because you hunt!!! The war is against all forms of hunting and they will not stop until all hunting is outlawed!!!

Let's help each other or we will all lose.

BTW, there are a number of anti hunting websites with many supporters. Where are the pro-hunting websites? Not the ones that are about hunting but the ones that have writers that write letters to send to congress, state government, local government and editors?

Enjoy,
Dan
 

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i agree with you javelina. there are some types of hunting that i don't particularly care for but that's my opinion. i'll defend the hunters choice no matter what type it is as long as it's legal. there are some things that my state doesn't allow that if they did, i wouldn't have a problem with.
 

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I agree with Varebel, I don't hunt the way many do,and I doubt they hunt the way I do.And thats fine.
But like Melegris said,people have different ways of doing things ,but that don't mean their wrong.
If you don't like the way someone hunts,well,don't do it.
As far as us being a dying breed,sadly I think it's leaning that way.:(
 

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Chitina_7, thank`s for taking the time to look up that info, and post it.

I lurk in anti-hunting sites occasionally, just to see some of the stuff they talk about. Some of their conversations range from mildly amusing...to absolutely appalling.

While I can agree that infighting among hunters is not in our best interest, there are some topics that I, and many other hunters cannot just sit by quietly and allow to transgress.

And while I will ALWAYS obey the hunting regs in whichever state I happen to be hunting, until some regs are put in place, I will VOCALLY and FINANCIALLY oppose them.

Some here seem to think that if others don`t share their views on these matters, they are whiners and troublemakers.

Well, that sword cuts both ways.

When I see that cute little phrase about don`t bash my ways......I see someone who just wants to be able to do whatever the heck they want to. That scares me. That is not the mindset that I am willing to rally around.
 

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Nice post Chitina,

We all need to know the difference between being vocal and supporting the sport, and being vocal and hurting it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Re: Support Hunting

Chitina_7 said:

Where do they get the ammunition to make a statement like this to a congressman? In forums like this one!! When a hunter condemns another form of hunting, the Anti-hunting groups will use hunters against hunters(and have). As most can see from their comments, they don't want to stop bear baiting, they want to stop hunting. They will take what they can, call it a victory, and move on to the next battle. They are looking at the outcome of the war not the outcome of the battle. We, as hunters, look at the outcome of the battle, not the war. Some hunters think "So what, I didn't like bear baiting anyway. I am an ethical hunter and nobody will come after my form of hunting." Well folks, these groups don't care what way you hunt!!! They don't consider you ethical because you hunt!!! The war is against all forms of hunting and they will not stop until all hunting is outlawed!!!

Let's help each other or we will all lose.

BTW, there are a number of anti hunting websites with many supporters. Where are the pro-hunting websites? Not the ones that are about hunting but the ones that have writers that write letters to send to congress, state government, local government and editors?

Enjoy,
Dan
Thank you Dan...

Here is one site that is pro hunting...

http://www.tednugent.com/cgi-bin/tnusa/nugeboard3/Ultimate.cgi?action=intro&BypassCookie=true
 

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Dittos for JAVELINA. I thought we all are on the same side. We may be in different flavors, but we like to bowhunt ethically or at least I thought?
 

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DT---good to see ya back on the board....I missed ya man...where ya been? Hope ya had a good time. Did you kill anything? Anyway good to have ya back
 

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kildog said:
DT---good to see ya back on the board....I missed ya man...where ya been? Hope ya had a good time. Did you kill anything? Anyway good to have ya back
Thanks, bro. I killed one. 8 of us killed 10 hogs. South Texas will never be the same. Shock & awe gallore. Doin it again real soon! :)
 

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Dying breed?

To answer your question Javelina. I do not believe we are dying out at all, as far as the term hunter is concerned. I think game taken per capita is on mark per each state and there's probably some states managed much wiser than others but overall I think it's doing ok. The revenues generated through hunting sales i.e. licenses, clothing and related gear like guns and bows are doing pretty darn good.
I just think we as air breathers seem to have a somewhat of a competitive nature and some folks will only tolerate certain changes as far as hunting techniques or forms used. As long as manufactures keep producing alternative means to hunt many will follow suit (I'm not saying this is wrong one iota). It just seems what is titled as old fashion or traditional is just a modernized version of the modernized already version of weapons and such. As long as options are put before us there will be many hunters to oblige these manufactures or the like.
Now far as hunting ethics well this debate will linger for the eons. You know the old saying "birds of a feather flock together" I think we have our inner circle of buddies we hunt with for good reasons.
In closing all I can say for myself is "I doubt I will ever book a chopper to shoot game by swooping down on them" I could be wrong in my assessment, I have been wrong once before:D. Anyways choppers are for jumping out of.
When faced without a challenge... make one!
Good post
Out for now.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Ex-Diver

You jump out of perfectly good choppers, way to much Tri-mix, that helium is good stuff.
 
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