im hopign someone can tell me why i cant get my back muscles to work, i set my stance my head and shoulders draw my bow and anchor and cant squeeze my back muscles, when i try to squeeze them 9 out of ten times my tricep squeezes in my back doesnt do anything,why?
back muscles wont work
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When I was going through my coaching class, the instructor had us pull with our arms against her hand which was against our tricep. Then she had us use back contraction to move the elbow around (sorry for the poor description). You could really feel the difference in the strength when using the back. I haven't had the opportnity to teach many people how to shoot a hinge release, but i did have 1 guy shoot one for about 30 minutes and he was able to get it to fire, though it was hit or miss (expectedly).
So if you have someone willing to help, mimic the full draw position and have someone place their hand against your tricep. Trace the jaw line with your hand by contracting your draw side back muscles. it may be possible you are trying to use the wrong muscles, but this exercise MAY help you find the right ones.
So if you have someone willing to help, mimic the full draw position and have someone place their hand against your tricep. Trace the jaw line with your hand by contracting your draw side back muscles. it may be possible you are trying to use the wrong muscles, but this exercise MAY help you find the right ones.
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back tension release
this may start an argument but here goes anyway. I read so many stories and post where you are supose to squease your shoulder blades togeather in order to properly shoot the back tension release to this I reply phooy
probely the biggest b.t. release maker is carter altho I may be wrong but if not they are close. call them and ask them how do I shoot a b.t. release, I did a long time ago spoke to jerry carter his reply was pull keep pulling and pull some more it will go off thats what they call suprise. you can punch a b.t. release just as quick as you can punch a trigger on a wrist release. now you should only have to pull a minute ammount. some squease there hand now they are controlling the shot, or squeese there pinky finger once again you are controlling the shot. pull, pull pull suprise it went off. go to a national tournment pick the top shooter there 300 X60 ask him for permission to place your hand between his shoulder blades so you can feel how he squeeses his back mussels what he dont well how do you get your release to go off. pull pull pull there is a previous post that said his coach had him push his elbo against her or his hand. bongo pull pull pull hope this helps
this may start an argument but here goes anyway. I read so many stories and post where you are supose to squease your shoulder blades togeather in order to properly shoot the back tension release to this I reply phooy
probely the biggest b.t. release maker is carter altho I may be wrong but if not they are close. call them and ask them how do I shoot a b.t. release, I did a long time ago spoke to jerry carter his reply was pull keep pulling and pull some more it will go off thats what they call suprise. you can punch a b.t. release just as quick as you can punch a trigger on a wrist release. now you should only have to pull a minute ammount. some squease there hand now they are controlling the shot, or squeese there pinky finger once again you are controlling the shot. pull, pull pull suprise it went off. go to a national tournment pick the top shooter there 300 X60 ask him for permission to place your hand between his shoulder blades so you can feel how he squeeses his back mussels what he dont well how do you get your release to go off. pull pull pull there is a previous post that said his coach had him push his elbo against her or his hand. bongo pull pull pull hope this helps
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Great analogy, thanks!
Draw length is such an important part of being able to use the right muscles in your back. If it's too long, you will have a great deal of trouble using them.
If it's too short you tend to jerk off target at the last fraction of a second.
To see what it should feel like, grab an arrow with both hands close together. Hold the arrow at about nose high and try to pull the arrow apart. Those are the muscles you should be using.
There seem to be as many ways to manipulate a release as there are people who are using them. In general you want to hold the tension of full draw with your back because that usually gives the steadiest hold, but after that, it's up to you to figure out the smoothest way to execute the shot.
Hope this helps,
Allen
If it's too short you tend to jerk off target at the last fraction of a second.
To see what it should feel like, grab an arrow with both hands close together. Hold the arrow at about nose high and try to pull the arrow apart. Those are the muscles you should be using.
There seem to be as many ways to manipulate a release as there are people who are using them. In general you want to hold the tension of full draw with your back because that usually gives the steadiest hold, but after that, it's up to you to figure out the smoothest way to execute the shot.
Hope this helps,
Allen
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I can't agree with edthearcher or xswanted. Back tension is a learned procedure and takes time to learn it - not a overnight thing or even sometimes over weeks.
In fact, one archery coach relayed that 10 weeks of dedicated practice was needed. Another bad thing about just pulling until it fires, some cams are not compatible as the "wall" is so soft that excessive draw is needed. A friend of mine had such a bow and used the "pull until it fired method." He would pull so hard, sometimes quickly, that his scores suffered. He became dejected and ended up giving up a truly nice bow. I tried the same bow/cam setup and did not have his problem. Basically, he was drawing so hard that his "sight picture" was changing - Think of where the peep is with the bow undrawn. Draw the bow and the peep lowers. Pull harder the peep lowers just a bit more. And if drawing inconsistently hard to fire a pure back tension release?
Most instructions that come with a hinge back tension release say to set them hard to go off. This starts the learning process. As you learn, you lighten the setting until one day it fires as if willed. Of course, set too light and you may "turn out your own lights." More than a few have busted themselves in the mouth, some so hard that were left bloody and well dazed, next to knocked out.
If you want to pull to get the release to fire then buy a pull/fire release. There are 2 or 3 on the market that I know of. You do have to be careful as these are set up to your draw weight, say 60 pounds, and when you apply 62 or 63 pounds they fire. Think of some shooters who just jerk back their bows when drawing - Yeah, arrow going downrange somewhere.
In fact, one archery coach relayed that 10 weeks of dedicated practice was needed. Another bad thing about just pulling until it fires, some cams are not compatible as the "wall" is so soft that excessive draw is needed. A friend of mine had such a bow and used the "pull until it fired method." He would pull so hard, sometimes quickly, that his scores suffered. He became dejected and ended up giving up a truly nice bow. I tried the same bow/cam setup and did not have his problem. Basically, he was drawing so hard that his "sight picture" was changing - Think of where the peep is with the bow undrawn. Draw the bow and the peep lowers. Pull harder the peep lowers just a bit more. And if drawing inconsistently hard to fire a pure back tension release?
Most instructions that come with a hinge back tension release say to set them hard to go off. This starts the learning process. As you learn, you lighten the setting until one day it fires as if willed. Of course, set too light and you may "turn out your own lights." More than a few have busted themselves in the mouth, some so hard that were left bloody and well dazed, next to knocked out.
If you want to pull to get the release to fire then buy a pull/fire release. There are 2 or 3 on the market that I know of. You do have to be careful as these are set up to your draw weight, say 60 pounds, and when you apply 62 or 63 pounds they fire. Think of some shooters who just jerk back their bows when drawing - Yeah, arrow going downrange somewhere.
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Arent the back muscles contracting when you are pulling???this may start an argument but here goes anyway. I read so many stories and post where you are supose to squease your shoulder blades togeather in order to properly shoot the back tension release to this I reply phooy
:zip:I like to think of it how xswanted does. I pull the whole time, but in my mind I think about, how can I anatomically anchor the same everytime, but cause my hand to make this release rotate and go off...
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Twigzz your back won't work because your using your arms too much to shoot your bow. Based on the pictures I have seen of you at full draw your form doesn't look bad but you have to learn how to hold the bow with your bones not your muscles. You look like a rugged kid so it's probably easy for you to overpower the bow with your arm strength, when you use your arm muscles too much your back doesn't get involved like it should. Stack your bones in behind the bow while at full draw then pull with your bones on the release side, (deaden your arm muscles), this will force your back muscles to hold the weight and cause more rotation to fire the release. Back tension not arm tension, you want the dynamic tension of the shot to hinge in your back muscles not your triceps, don't "bench press" the shot.
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May I suggest Tournament Archers article on BT releases? I don't think you want to be squeezing your back muscles.
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Agreed
Back tension, IMHO, is more intended to maintain your form/posture and prevent the shoulders from collapsing, than to "make the release go off.
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You're right. It's just that the muscles used are on the back. Actually, looking at the many pictures shown in several articles, it's the muscle or group of muscles between the back and shoulder blade. The Rhomboid muscles are used to retract the scapula. Learning to move these is the trick. Just getting these muscles moving is one thing - Learning to wait for the release to go off is another. As I had said, once you get the hang of it you can adjust the release for lighter and lighter settings.
CutTheLoop brings up a good point, posture, good form. Back tension does require good form. Bent over, sloppy form, the release is difficult to get to fire. Standing erect, head up and looking to the target, perfect draw fit and all that goes with a good setup, you bring the bow to you, not you going to the bow.
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learning to use b.t. can be a frustrating task, i tell my students to try lifting and rotating their elbow in a circle (for right handers). the high elbow helps to transfer to your back. if you still cant get your back into it try very small draw length changes. if your back is already contracted you have nowhere to go. by the way you will have horrible shots for awhile as you train yourself . best yet get a coach:darkbeer:
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Check out Core Archery, by Larry Wise.
Imagine a big elastic band from your draw elbow to your bow hand across your back. At full draw, that band is tight, but everthing else that is non essential is relaxed. Then tighten your rhomboids, if your draw length is correct, your draw elbow will move ever so slightly back and down, which if you don't fight it with your draw hand, will fire the release.
Practice with a piece of string, and adjust the length til you can get your rhomboids to work. An Evo or Squeeze Me makes it easier to learn. Then transfer to hinge or other BT release.
What Fita Freak, above says works to show you the rhomboids, I tried it.
Slowhandstl
Imagine a big elastic band from your draw elbow to your bow hand across your back. At full draw, that band is tight, but everthing else that is non essential is relaxed. Then tighten your rhomboids, if your draw length is correct, your draw elbow will move ever so slightly back and down, which if you don't fight it with your draw hand, will fire the release.
Practice with a piece of string, and adjust the length til you can get your rhomboids to work. An Evo or Squeeze Me makes it easier to learn. Then transfer to hinge or other BT release.
What Fita Freak, above says works to show you the rhomboids, I tried it.
Slowhandstl
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6,493 Posts
back tension
sonny I totaly agree with you also,but some of thease guys are thinking that if I stand on the line, pull my string back, anchor, and squeeze my back mussles the release will go off. wrong. also you see posts how can I shoot back tennison with my wrist release.????? as I mentioned before you can punch a back tension the same as you can punch a thumb release. if at full draw you take your pinky finger and punch the end it will go off, relax you index finger quickley it will go off. thats not back tension. by pulling at the right preasure the release will rotate in your hand. bingo it fired. a thumb release also works the same some squeeze with there pinky gently the release is now rotating, there thumb is over the trigger as it rotates the trigger pushes into the thumb base, depresses and bingo it goes off. some people it even takes a year to really learn how to use one right. and Ill say it again if you want to learn dont put a target on the back stop. shot 6 feet from the back stop and keep shooting and shooting you may have to tweek your draw length to find a sweet spot. I have even seen top archers who shoot a b.t. at pratice, then when they step up to the line they have a thumb release. so you say I dont have the time or several months to learn all that. thats great dont buy a b.t. there are a loy of great shooters out there who pop 300 X 60 with there wrist release
one final comment this has been a great post and a learning one I think for all. now thats what archery talk is all about. there was no mention of I have the best release or I have the best bow. good luck to the guy who started it ED
sonny I totaly agree with you also,but some of thease guys are thinking that if I stand on the line, pull my string back, anchor, and squeeze my back mussles the release will go off. wrong. also you see posts how can I shoot back tennison with my wrist release.????? as I mentioned before you can punch a back tension the same as you can punch a thumb release. if at full draw you take your pinky finger and punch the end it will go off, relax you index finger quickley it will go off. thats not back tension. by pulling at the right preasure the release will rotate in your hand. bingo it fired. a thumb release also works the same some squeeze with there pinky gently the release is now rotating, there thumb is over the trigger as it rotates the trigger pushes into the thumb base, depresses and bingo it goes off. some people it even takes a year to really learn how to use one right. and Ill say it again if you want to learn dont put a target on the back stop. shot 6 feet from the back stop and keep shooting and shooting you may have to tweek your draw length to find a sweet spot. I have even seen top archers who shoot a b.t. at pratice, then when they step up to the line they have a thumb release. so you say I dont have the time or several months to learn all that. thats great dont buy a b.t. there are a loy of great shooters out there who pop 300 X 60 with there wrist release
one final comment this has been a great post and a learning one I think for all. now thats what archery talk is all about. there was no mention of I have the best release or I have the best bow. good luck to the guy who started it ED
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I switched to back tension because of 'Target Panic' a few years back.
Learned on a Zenith with the full cam . (can't fire an arrow) I used the clicker on that full cam to let me know when the arrow would have been released.
As stated above. Takes a lot of practice to make back tension work consistently. It needs to be sub-conscience. You shouldn't have to think about it... just aim.
Lot's of good advise here....Good Luck.
Nick
Learned on a Zenith with the full cam . (can't fire an arrow) I used the clicker on that full cam to let me know when the arrow would have been released.
As stated above. Takes a lot of practice to make back tension work consistently. It needs to be sub-conscience. You shouldn't have to think about it... just aim.
Lot's of good advise here....Good Luck.
Nick
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Birddawg, I think I know what you mean by "behind you", but would you mind being more specific. where exactly is behind you at?
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