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okay,so i read 'idiotproof archery'[$35 and i'll send it to you] . some good ideas but basically an ego trip for author . been shooting at blank bale and periodically shooting 20 yard target . i shoot better groups with my eyes closed [ten yards] than i do at 20 yards eyes open . i really want to shoot well [well enough to satisfy me not others] but it's not going to happen .truth is the only thing i've ever done satisfactorily is my job ,which is a happy coincidence . by the way ,i pull with my back,but my shoulders get tired on the very top ,up toward my neck . i feel i know how to shoot but just can't do it . thanks for listening . serious about book send me a pm . bc
 

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big cypress said:
okay,so i read 'idiotproof archery'[$35 and i'll send it to you] . some good ideas but basically an ego trip for author . been shooting at blank bale and periodically shooting 20 yard target . i shoot better groups with my eyes closed [ten yards] than i do at 20 yards eyes open . i really want to shoot well [well enough to satisfy me not others] but it's not going to happen .truth is the only thing i've ever done satisfactorily is my job ,which is a happy coincidence . by the way ,i pull with my back,but my shoulders get tired on the very top ,up toward my neck . i feel i know how to shoot but just can't do it . thanks for listening . serious about book send me a pm . bc
BC, no easy way to get good at archery other than practice, practice and more practice. I would also suggest finding a coach. Books work for teaching some things but in my opinion archery isn't one of them and it appears that you've found that out also.
 

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big cypress said:
okay,so i read 'idiotproof archery'[$35 and i'll send it to you] . some good ideas but basically an ego trip for author . been shooting at blank bale and periodically shooting 20 yard target . i shoot better groups with my eyes closed [ten yards] than i do at 20 yards eyes open . i really want to shoot well [well enough to satisfy me not others] but it's not going to happen .truth is the only thing i've ever done satisfactorily is my job ,which is a happy coincidence . by the way ,i pull with my back,but my shoulders get tired on the very top ,up toward my neck . i feel i know how to shoot but just can't do it . thanks for listening . serious about book send me a pm . bc
if the top of you shoulders are getting tired you are not holding the bow back with you back muscels. when you draw feel you back hold the bow weight. relax top of shoulders. then trip the release from there by moving your elbow back. you can do it... :tongue:
 

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Roland is correct. You can't learn archery from a book. In fact if you mis-interpret what you read in a book, it can set you back significantly.

You are right IPA is about 85% stuff you don't want to read. The emphasis on personality type is a waste of ink. It may or may not be true, but the emphasis is a waste. His chapter on anticipation is as good as anything I've ever read on the subject. It's worth referring back to as you get better and are looking for ways to solve problems with your shooting.

However, the 15% good stuff is what Bernie learned from Len Cardinale who is one of the best ever. If you can weed out the garbage from the solid information, the book is a valuable resource. But like Roland posted, you need a coach to get really good at archery.

It just depends on how good you want to be.
 

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Practice , practice, practice, yes but only if you are doing it right and not instilling bad habits. Its better to only take 20 good shots vs 200 bad shots.
 

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Find a coach

If your serious
 

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Join a club!

If you are interested in archery, and want to improve - join a club or league. When you shoot with a group you will see how others do it, you will get pointers on technique... and it is more fun.

Good shooting!

CBMac
 

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big cypress, I have no idea what your talent level is. It could very well be that all the practice in the world won't make you as good as you believe is possible. For example, I could shoot a few thousand 3 pointers and still not be as good as Michael Jordan on his bad days. The thing that helps me maintain my sanity is that I don't expect to be Michael Jordan.

The fact that you stated that the ONLY thing you've ever done satisfactorily is your job is reason to be concerned. You may (due to unrealistic expectations or a defeatist attitude) have sabotaged your efforts before you even began.

It's gotta be fun. Unless your life depended on it, or your sole source of income was archery, why would you rob it of enjoyment?

Good luck to you man!
 

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Get a coach

No question, the best way to improve is to get a coach. Practice does not make perfect. Only perfect practice makes perfect.

I visit Terry Wunderle a couple times a year because he's not too far away and I believe in the value of what he has taught me. Over the years, Terry's description of the perfect shot has never changed, but my idea of what the perfect shot feels like has changed as my ability and experience have matured.

Whatever you think you learned from Bernie's book I'm sure it can use a tweak from a good coach, and with the new knowledge that you gain your practice can gradually move toward perfect practice.

Also, remember, if your goal is to some day out shoot Dave Cousins you are likely destined for discouragement, but if your goal is to constantly shoot better, then you are very likely to succeed. IMHO it's difficult to learn archery from a book but a book that can improve your archery or anything else you do is "With Winning in Mind" by Lanny Basham. Pay special attention to what he calls "The Directive Affirmation".
 

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KSNimrod said:
big cypress, I have no idea what your talent level is. It could very well be that all the practice in the world won't make you as good as you believe is possible. For example, I could shoot a few thousand 3 pointers and still not be as good as Michael Jordan on his bad days. The thing that helps me maintain my sanity is that I don't expect to be Michael Jordan.

The fact that you stated that the ONLY thing you've ever done satisfactorily is your job is reason to be concerned. You may (due to unrealistic expectations or a defeatist attitude) have sabotaged your efforts before you even began.

It's gotta be fun. Unless your life depended on it, or your sole source of income was archery, why would you rob it of enjoyment?

Good luck to you man!
Yeap, I agree. I have a hard time with this one too. I perhaps would say, I have unrealistic expectations more than anything else. Sometimes, it gets in the way of enjoyment. Perhaps, it is as Bernie does say about Class A personalities, I think too much.

IMO, any hobby can does become a mental game. I certainly does in archery and golf, etc. In many cases, we do put too much emphases on perfection and kill the fun in the process.

I like competition. I don't win because I don't expect to win, but you have to preactice competition to win also. I do well and I try to maintain my objectives. If you don't keep control of your objectives and start setting unrealistic expectations then they become self defeating. But, I think this is the point, Bernie may be trying to get accross. We do indead play a mental head game on ourselves.

I have read the book several timees. I wouldn't throw the book away for now. But, when you have time, read it again, from cover to cover, before making any judgement.
 

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Having spent many years competing in bronc riding I can tell you that rodeo is a mental game without equal. Ask most and they will tell you that it is 10% physical and 90% mental. That is why I enjoy archery so much, there are many similarities in mental focus. Now that I am retired from the rough games, archery helps keep me mentally sharp. You have to believe in yourself and your abilities or it ain't worth the effort. In coaching young contestants, I have been known to tell them that if they don't believe they can win, they are wasting their entry fees. Your focus has to be able to come to a pin point, on command, and you can only do that by repetition. Yes you do have to have the physical form correct to perform at a high level, but belief in your ability and willing the arrow into the spot is a big part of it.

I believe that many archers do not spend enough time concentrating when they are practicing, repeating all of the form steps that are required and then focusing on their spot and seeing the arrow hit it before it even leaves.
 

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Back tension turns so many people off from shooting. "Turn your rhomboid, rotate your scapula, pull your shoulder this way AHHHHH IT HURTS MAN!!"


Don't over complicate it.


Set your finger/thumb on the tirgger and just pull backwards. There is no sense in thinking about the muscles. Just pull back and your using the right muscles. In fact, it's near impossible to use the wrong muscles by just simply pulling.

Stick with it, have fun, and just shoot. ;)
 

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thanks for the replies . i like to shoot but i try so hard i've realized that it really is more work than fun . i really can't think of anything i do that is fun [serious not kidding]. by the way i shoot fingers .i don't drink,don't smoke ,and don't shoot fingers and will not bad mouth you if you wish to do any or all of these things . bc
 

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!

Hey BC whats up,i dont know how long youve been shooting,or what bow you shoot,ect.....but here are a couple of things that helped me out,,,,,,first i shoot my bow at 55#,i can shoot longer sessions that way,no sore back,also i changed my grip,and the biggest thing ive done to improve my shooting is keep both eyes open when looking at my pins.....also i got La Earls dvd on tuning,and that was the icing on the cake........anyway good luck,,,,,,,,,,its a good feeling when it all comes together,its worth the effort,trust me.......:darkbeer:
 

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What is your goal in Archery?

You say your good at your job. I bet you have clearly defined goals at work. You acheive your goal and you think you did well. Do you challenge yourself by setting goals you'll never reach? Most people set realistic goals at work, and then set unrealistic goals for the rest of their life.

What do you want to accomplish in Archery? Is it a perfect score? It can be done, but consitently? I bowled a 300 the other day. I would not set that as my goal for every game since I average 120. My goal is to average 150 by the end of the year. I know I am capable of bowling a 300...I proved that to myself. But that is not my goal.

Practice is the fastest way to making yourself better if you have the knowledge to back up those shots. Reading the book gives you some of that knowledge. I do not believe you need a coach to get good at archery. If you want to compete with the big boys a coach is definately in order. But if all you do is shoot against your buddies, you can out shoot them by practicing the right stuff.

I started shooting competition in 1984. I got advice from a roommate on how to shoot consistent groups. Within 3 months of practicing I was winning tournaments. Mind you, these were not FITA tournaments, but they were styled after them. I was not competing against people fropm Las Vegas...I was competing against people who were stationed near me in soutrhern West Germany. Bottom line is, this stuff is not rocket science. And you don't need to turn it into such. Just be one with the arrow (sounds cheesy, but that's what works for me).

I personally am not going to compete on the open circuts. I can shoot a 2 inch group at 40 yards. I could get that group smaller if I keep practicing. 6 months ago I was shooting 4 inch groups at 30 yards. Part of the solution was practice...part was tuning my equipment. But never in my life have I used a coach...and I am getting better. So I call BS on the need for a coach. I also call BS on the need for pro shops to make your bow work. Get to know your equipment. The best way to get to know it is to work on it yourself. Find a group of archers who are willing to teach this to you and you are half way down the path of getting better. Stay away from those who tell you you have to have a pro shop do the work. No pro shop in the world is going to tune the bow so YOU shoot it best. You have to do that yourself.

Pay attention to the arguments about equipment and form on these forums. There is a lot of gold nuggest burried in piles of cr**. Learn from them...but don't take anything for gospel till you prove it to yourself. I get a lot of tips reading this site. I use those tips as a starting point. I modify them as I see fit and use what works.

Good luck with it. If it turns out this sport is not for you, try fishing...it's much more relaxing...if the fish leave you alone.

Nate
 

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big cypress said:
thanks for the replies . i like to shoot but i try so hard i've realized that it really is more work than fun . i really can't think of anything i do that is fun [serious not kidding]. by the way i shoot fingers .i don't drink,don't smoke ,and don't shoot fingers and will not bad mouth you if you wish to do any or all of these things . bc
There's your problem. Try drinking a little.

Why do you not have any fun? Seriously...you need a shrink to solve this problem. Life is supposed to be more fun than not fun. That does not mean you should be irresponsible...it means you should seek things that you enjoy doing. Don't kick yourself in the ass too much...leave that for your dad. You're suppose to seek your God given inalianable right to the persuit of happiness!

PS...I was shooting fingers until the last week of June this year. I swore I'd never switch. Welll...I jumped ship and I am loving it. There is nothing mystical about shooting fingers. I always thought there was. But...I found that I enjoy shooting arcvhery just as much with a releasae as I did with fingers. Only now tuning my bow is easier.

Nate
 

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Discussion Starter #19
stucknthemud,thanks. i lost my job to a computer 5 years ago . i don't shoot with buddies if anyone shows up at the range i leave . if i were ever to consider a release i'd just buy a gun and not bother running down range to retrieve my 'projectile' . appreciate your thoughts. . .peace
 

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big cypress said:
ummm,lets make that''and i don't shoot release ''.

don't matter hold the bow back your back muscels then relax you hand and fingers continue pulling back with you back until the string slips from your fingers. All the better finger shooters do it that way I am told.. :)
 
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