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Ok. So here's what I've done so far and current results.
To get rid of the majority of the right lean, I think there's just a hair of right lean at full draw..... I've added 2 twist to top left yoke and removed 2 from the right.

Then I had to add 6 twists to bottom cam, my top cam now hits about 2 mm before my bottom cam. I left it as is as far as draw stops are concerned. Would probably a half an twist on top get the perfect?

View attachment 7415769


After getting to the above point, checked draw length and I'm at 28" ( supposed to be 28.5). BH 6" and ATA is 31 7/8.
I added two twist to bottom and top cam and grew my draw length to 28.25". Draw weight 70.26 lb so that's correct

This is where I stopped and looking for assistance. Bottom cam now has 8 Total twists and now the top has 2. Should I keep adding a twist to both top and bottom cam and keep trying to grow my draw length to the correct length of 28.5? or should I look to twisting or untwisting the string?
That's a lot of twists, but I'd twist it until I got the bow where I wanted it.
When you're staying the DL, how are you measuring that?

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Discussion Starter · #122 ·
That's a lot of twists, but I'd twist it until I got the bow where I wanted it.
When you're staying the DL, how are you measuring that?

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Marked a spot on the riser in line with the deepest point in my grip. Mark arrow at full draw. The measure from the throat of the nock to the mark on the arrow and add 1 3/4"?
 

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Discussion Starter · #123 ·
That's a lot of twists, but I'd twist it until I got the bow where I wanted it.
When you're staying the DL, how are you measuring that?

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And that's why I stopped. The number of twists. In the press on the cable is getting pretty dang knotted up. Obviously clears up when I take it out. But I wanted to wait and get a better idea so I'm not having to undo a bunch
 

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And that's why I stopped. The number of twists. In the press on the cable is getting pretty dang knotted up. Obviously clears up when I take it out. But I wanted to wait and get a better idea so I'm not having to undo a bunch
I'd honestly call the string maker if the cables are reacting that way to the number of twists you put in it.

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Discussion Starter · #125 ·
I'd honestly call the string maker if the cables are reacting that way to the number of twists you put in it.

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Talked with 60x. Very responsive but they are saying twist rate is fine. However, there should be no need for any of this. They think something is set wrong with the bow as the timing marks are way off. Bottom cam was hitting about 3/4" before the top cam. After adding 6 twists to the bottom they are about perfect. Sent picture of timing marks and 60x feels the bottom cam should be hitting 3/4" before the top as is (they are hitting perfect) He thinks a mods is wrong on one of the cams. I've never adjusted the mods or post. With that manual you sent me (chart 1, over drive binary cam). Both mods on top and bottom should be on #4 with draw stop post also on 4? I'll look again when I get home, but I do not think the mods are matching top and bottom
 

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Talked with 60x. Very responsive but they are saying twist rate is fine. However, there should be no need for any of this. They think something is set wrong with the bow as the timing marks are way off. Bottom cam was hitting about 3/4" before the top cam. After adding 6 twists to the bottom they are about perfect. Sent picture of timing marks and 60x feels the bottom cam should be hitting 3/4" before the top as is (they are hitting perfect) He thinks a mods is wrong on one of the cams. I've never adjusted the mods or post. With that manual you sent me (chart 1, over drive binary cam). Both mods on top and bottom should be on #4 with draw stop post also on 4? I'll look again when I get home, but I do not think the mods are matching top and bottom
I'm not sure about the specifics, but set the kids the same if they aren't, that's your problem if the mods are not the same. If this is the case, you will likely have to redo cam sync.

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Discussion Starter · #127 · (Edited)
I'm not sure about the specifics, but set the kids the same if they aren't, that's your problem if the mods are not the same. If this is the case, you will likely have to redo cam sync.

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Edited post
The top mod post is on #5 (mod screws on both cams are in random spots so I have no idea if that matters) and draw stop is set on #5 those both are for 29" draw.

Bottom mod post is set on #7 which is for 27" draw with draw stop post on #5. Again, the mod screw is in a radom spot. How could this possibly happen or why would it be set this way?
So since the bottom is set on a shorter draw lenght, when string installed that would cause the bottom cam to hit so much soon and require so many twists to bring the top cam in? I feel like an idiot but no idea why he would have adjusted like that or what the thought process is
From the chart, both need be on mod post 4 for 28.5. It was set on 29" for years. I recently had them adjust it to 28.5 and that's when I started noticing problems and having to keep coming back for tuning issues. I never seemed to get anywhere so I started this myself.

I will remove all twists tonight, set both mods back to 4 and draw post to 4. Any idea if the mod screws location makes a difference?

7416309


7416311
 

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I just ran home because this is bugging me. Top cam mod on 1 and bottom cam mod on 4. This is freaking outrageous. That would be why the top cam is 3/4 ft drop stop on install. Mod 1 is for 30" and mod 4 is 28.5

View attachment 7416309

View attachment 7416311
Glad you got it figured out! It’s always a little frustrating when we struggle to get a bow to tune only to find out that it was something basic that we overlooked. I’ve been there. You have your little face palm moment , but then it’s just a relief to have it solved and move on. I wish one of us had thought to have you check that earlier and saved you some headaches with it. Once you get a chance to get the mods set the same and get everything back in spec and timed, let us know how it tunes for you. I bet it’s going to be easy and at least you have learned a lot through this process about your bow and how it reacts to twisting and untwisting each piece of the harnessing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #129 ·
Glad you got it figured out! It’s always a little frustrating when we struggle to get a bow to tune only to find out that it was something basic that we overlooked. I’ve been there. You have your little face palm moment , but then it’s just a relief to have it solved and move on. I wish one of us had thought to have you check that earlier and saved you some headaches with it. Once you get a chance to get the mods set the same and get everything back in spec and timed, let us know how it tunes for you. I bet it’s going to be easy and at least you have learned a lot through this process about your bow and how it reacts to twisting and untwisting each piece of the harnessing.
I posted and realized I miss spoke as far as the mod screw and mod post location. Top mod post was set on 5 (29" which is what I had it set at for years) then bottom mod post was set to 7 which is 27" per the chart. I had him drop my DL down to 28.5 and he did that, but he had to have added a ton of twists to get both stops hitting the same time and that clearly didn't raise any red flags to him.
 

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I posted and realized I miss spoke as far as the mod screw and mod post location. Top mod post was set on 5 (29" which is what I had it set at for years) then bottom mod post was set to 7 which is 27" per the chart. I had him drop my DL down to 28.5 and he did that, but he had to have added a ton of twists to get both stops hitting the same time and that clearly didn't raise any red flags to him.
All the more reason why it’s a great thing that you’re learning to do your own setup and tuning. That’s just insanity that a tech working in a “pro” shop had that set that way. Ridiculous.
 

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I posted and realized I miss spoke as far as the mod screw and mod post location. Top mod post was set on 5 (29" which is what I had it set at for years) then bottom mod post was set to 7 which is 27" per the chart. I had him drop my DL down to 28.5 and he did that, but he had to have added a ton of twists to get both stops hitting the same time and that clearly didn't raise any red flags to him.
This is why I do all the work on my bows. You will screw up but when you create and stick to a system, you'll be able to check your work.
In this case:
Set bow to spec (including cam lean in bowtechs)
Set mods and stops to your DL starting point
Set arrow level and centered
Shoot through paper and/or bareshaft tune and adjust as needed.
When you get it dialed in, record all your measurements.

Do this EVERY time you make a change.
New strings? Do it.
Change nocking point? Do it
Haven't shot your bow in a while? Might as well.
Never assume anything, trust but verify; it'll save you hours, sleep, and headaches.



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Discussion Starter · #132 ·
This is why I do all the work on my bows. You will screw up but when you create and stick to a system, you'll be able to check your work.
In this case:
Set bow to spec (including cam lean in bowtechs)
Set mods and stops to your DL starting point
Set arrow level and centered
Shoot through paper and/or bareshaft tune and adjust as needed.
When you get it dialed in, record all your measurements.

Do this EVERY time you make a change.
New strings? Do it.
Change nocking point? Do it
Haven't shot your bow in a while? Might as well.
Never assume anything, trust but verify; it'll save you hours, sleep, and headaches.



Sent from my motorola one 5G ace using Tapatalk
So cam lean is correct, when I installed the string it had cam lean right at full draw, made adjustments. Should I remove any of those twists to start? After I fix mods, I will need to remove 8 twists from bottom and 2 from top (6 twists to get cams synced and then added 2 for both top and bottom to try and grow my DL) But will removing twists to the cables effect cam lean at all? Not knowing any better (clearly I don't) my first thought is to remove cable twists, put on the draw board and check. From there I would remove twists from left or right depending on lean?
 

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So cam lean is correct, when I installed the string it had cam lean right at full draw, made adjustments. Should I remove any of those twists to start? After I fix mods, I will need to remove 8 twists from bottom and 2 from top (6 twists to get cams synced and then added 2 for both top and bottom to try and grow my DL) But will removing twists to the cables effect cam lean at all? Not knowing any better (clearly I don't) my first thought is to remove cable twists, put on the draw board and check. From there I would remove twists from left or right depending on lean?
Honestly, this is what I would suggest:
Set bow to spec (including cam lean in bowtechs)
Set mods and stops to your DL starting point
Set arrow level and centered
Shoot through paper and/or bareshaft tune and adjust as needed.
When you get it dialed in, record all your measurements.

Lots of folks have input about cam lean, but I would go with what bowtechs suggests. At brace, there's a factory spec amount of cam lean. You can do it at full draw if you want, in this case, check it with the mods being set properly and adjust if needed.
Some if this seems redundant at this point, but do it, make sure you stick to a system and you will decrease the possibility of chasing your tail because if something like the mods being set differently.
 

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Discussion Starter · #134 ·
Honestly, this is what I would suggest:
Set bow to spec (including cam lean in bowtechs)
Set mods and stops to your DL starting point
Set arrow level and centered
Shoot through paper and/or bareshaft tune and adjust as needed.
When you get it dialed in, record all your measurements.

Lots of folks have input about cam lean, but I would go with what bowtechs suggests. At brace, there's a factory spec amount of cam lean. You can do it at full draw if you want, in this case, check it with the mods being set properly and adjust if needed.
Some if this seems redundant at this point, but do it, make sure you stick to a system and you will decrease the possibility of chasing your tail because if something like the mods being set differently.
I watched those videos but I do not have a laser to rough in the cam lean so I was just basically looking at the lean at brace and making sure nothing was crazy bad. Then just watching the draw board to make sure it wouldn't derail or anything. Then made adjustments from there. I was more or less just wondering if it would have an effect on lean so that if I did just remove twists, the lean wouldn't be all out of whack and derail if I was checking timing.
 

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I watched those videos but I do not have a laser to rough in the cam lean so I was just basically looking at the lean at brace and making sure nothing was crazy bad. Then just watching the draw board to make sure it wouldn't derail or anything. Then made adjustments from there. I was more or less just wondering if it would have an effect on lean so that if I did just remove twists, the lean wouldn't be all out of whack and derail if I was checking timing.
In lieu of having the laser, I think you can take 2 arrows against the cams and make sure they cross right near somewhere between your nocking point and the cable guard. That get you close to spec. If you notice from the guide, the cams have about the same lean at brace
 

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Discussion Starter · #136 ·
In lieu of having the laser, I think you can take 2 arrows against the cams and make sure they Ross right near somewhere between your nocking point and the cable guard. That get you close to spec. If you notice from the guide, the cams have about the same lean at brace
I did notice that which is opposite of what I do/read. Set up with arrow crossing at the nock point and then set it up so there is zero cam lean at full draw. I'll give it a shot.
Thanks for all your help
 

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Discussion Starter · #137 ·
In lieu of having the laser, I think you can take 2 arrows against the cams and make sure they Ross right near somewhere between your nocking point and the cable guard. That get you close to spec. If you notice from the guide, the cams have about the same lean at brace
Well that was pretty simple after all the necessary correct corrections. After removing all the twists. Two two twists to right yoke for cam lean. And 1 twist on top and it was good to go.
 

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Discussion Starter · #138 ·
Thanks again for everyone's in put and letting me ramble. Cost some unnecessary money but in the end it was a heck of a learning experience
 

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Discussion Starter · #139 ·
Well a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in awhile. Easton Hexx 260 with 100 gr insert, 100 gr point. 486 TAW. Arrow level and running parallel to the riser.
Paper tears on the right are from two weeks ago when I started this debacle. Arrow on the left is first shot on paper after break in period on new strings and correct placement of draw mods. 🤣😂🤣😂. I'll hit the indoor range tomorrow to bare shaft tune at 20
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Nice looks like you can speed up top cam or slow down bottom a bit. With that slight tail low tear.
Bareshaft will tell you better than that though. If your bareshafts are hitting high, put 1/2 twist in each bottom cam yoke or take 1/2 twist out if reach top cam yokes and see if that fixes it. (I recommend yokes here for finer tining as 1/2 twists on cable ends will lead to busted serving.
 
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