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Discussion Starter #1
I keep seeing posts about using a d-loop to change your drawlength.

I disagree.

If you change your d-loop length, you are just changing your anchor point. I have the string touch the end of my nose in the same place no matter how long my loop is. ( one of my three anchor points that keeps my head in a repeatable position ) Now I must say all of my bows are 38 to 41" ATA. I'm sure I couldn't do this with a short axled bow my drawlength. I'd like to hear what others have to say about this. :wink:

Thanks,
Nick
 

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You're correct in your assessment. I think I would only correct a couple things though.

I do not use the nose on the string to keep my head in alignment. Once a make target acquisition I draw the bow and anchor without moving my head. I just look at what I intend to aim at. I adjust the bow accordingly. Maybe the same thing you meant, just saying it backwards.

And adding a loop doesn't change where the string touches me (lips and nose). All the loop does is change the length your body is stretched out, so to get body (drawing arm) alignment right you should have a release that is adjustable for length and/or intended for loop use (short head). And keep the loop no longer than is necessary to clear the nock with the release head.

So I think that basically we are in agreement.

For the record I'm 5'8" tall, 27" draw and prefer bows in the 36" to 40" range. And I don't use a loop, but a rope release which just boils down to having the loop on the release.
 

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No it does change your draw length If I have a one inch d-loop and keep the same anchor point I must extend your bow arm to make up for the 1 inch diff.
(I just used a 1 inch loop as an example) thus changing you draw length. however I you use a string style relase and chang to a d-loop of the same length it does not change most of the change comes form people using a claper style relase.
 

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I think you're both right on the money. I recently went to a short ATA bow.Given the sharper string angle, the string no longer touches my nose. It's not a draw length thing. I actually made an "adjustable" release to be comfortable, because I have small hands and was always reaching for the trigger. I removed the bolt and replaced it with a piece of parachute cord that was cut to exactally where I wanted the trigger to end up. With that release in hand, I was then fitted for my new bow.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
bfisher
I also aquire target, and once at full draw position the bow to my stance and upright head position.

scope shotter
If I used a longer d-loop my anchor would move back. Maybe I'm set in my ways but I like the string on my nose. That is why I really don't care for short axle bows.

Nick
 

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Nick1959 said:
bfisher
I also aquire target, and once at full draw position the bow to my stance and upright head position.

scope shotter
If I used a longer d-loop my anchor would move back. Maybe I'm set in my ways but I like the string on my nose. That is why I really don't care for short axle bows.

Nick
Hello Nick:

It's all just terminology.

People really are referring to the distance between
the grip and their release hand.

The distance between the release hand and the grip of the bow
has three parts, each of which can be adjusted.....

a) nock groove to the pivot point of the bow (deepest part of the curve)...
this is the bow draw length setting...add 1.75 inches to this measurement, and you get the AMO draw length number

b) d-loop length or rope loop length

c) neck of the handle release or
on a wrist strap release, the distance from the strap to the trigger


All three of these things affect the "bow fit to the shooter"
or the distance from the release hand to the bow grip.


If you switch from a Scott Longhorn to a Carter Evolution release,
the distance from your release hand to the nock groove will be slightly different. This affects the total distance from the release hand to the bow grip, and thus affects how the bow fits you.



If you shoot with a 1/4-inch d-loop and then switch to a 1-inch d-loop,
you have also affected the total distance from the release hand to the bow grip, and thus changed how the bow fits you.



If you have a draw length module, and move the screw from the "B" setting on the cam-1/2 module and move it to the "F" setting on the cam-1/2 module, you have increased the AMO draw length,
and have obviously changed how the bow fits you.


Change any of the three things listed above,
and you will change the total distance from your release hand to the bow grip.


Find the right total distance from your release hand to the bow grip
for you, down to the 1/64th or down to the 1/32nd or down to the 1/16th of an inch (a little change in this total distance, can be felt, and be hard to measure) and you will improve your accuracy. It's mostly a target shooter thing.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
nuts&bolts said:
Hello Nick:

It's all just terminology.

People really are referring to the distance between
the grip and their release hand.

The distance between the release hand and the grip of the bow
has three parts, each of which can be adjusted.....

a) nock groove to the pivot point of the bow (deepest part of the curve)...
this is the bow draw length setting...add 1.75 inches to this measurement, and you get the AMO draw length number

b) d-loop length or rope loop length

c) neck of the handle release or
on a wrist strap release, the distance from the strap to the trigger


All three of these things affect the "bow fit to the shooter"
or the distance from the release hand to the bow grip.


If you switch from a Scott Longhorn to a Carter Evolution release,
the distance from your release hand to the nock groove will be slightly different. This affects the total distance from the release hand to the bow grip, and thus affects how the bow fits you.



If you shoot with a 1/4-inch d-loop and then switch to a 1-inch d-loop,
you have also affected the total distance from the release hand to the bow grip, and thus changed how the bow fits you.



If you have a draw length module, and move the screw from the "B" setting on the cam-1/2 module and move it to the "F" setting on the cam-1/2 module, you have increased the AMO draw length,
and have obviously changed how the bow fits you.


Change any of the three things listed above,
and you will change the total distance from your release hand to the bow grip.


Find the right total distance from your release hand to the bow grip
for you, down to the 1/64th or down to the 1/32nd or down to the 1/16th of an inch (a little change in this total distance, can be felt, and be hard to measure) and you will improve your accuracy. It's mostly a target shooter thing.
Lug Nut,

I agree with everything your saying. I play spots all winter and have tried the one, or two string twists to change draw. I cannot pull the string past the end of my nose so a longer d-loop moves my anchor.

Now as far as fit.... yes changing the d-loop will change a bows fit and feel for me. So it looks like we're all right. :wink:

Nick
 

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Hay, Nick, why are you worried about draw length? Don't you have enough!!!:)

I do agree, that the draw length doesn't change with the D-loop length. The only thing that changes is the ability to the achieve the desired anchor point. Now, some guys want to put the string by their ears and others don't.

IMO, if someone gets their D-loop too long, they can actually start varying their anchor point and therefore they will have more high and low misses. This I think will happen in hilly country more than during level shooting and it makes some sense. Perhaps, this is one reason for some having more trouble shooting out of tree stands. A good shooter told me that one time and I have always kept my loop short since. I live in very hilly country.

Perhaps, Nuts & Bolts might eliborate on this.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Deezlin said:
Hay, Nick, why are you worried about draw length? Don't you have enough!!!:)
I have plenty of draw. :wink: That's why I can never find arrows to buy here on AT. To short :mad:

NIck
 

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Some very good analogies here. When giving it more thought it is about terminology. I kinda think we get the terminology mixed up. We, as human beings do not have a draw length per-se so are all wrong when we use the term as such.

A bow does have a draw length and no matter how long our loop, the rope on our release, the length of our release or where we anchor the draw length does not change unless we physically change the bow.
 
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