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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've been shooting traditional archery on and off since February. Since then, at 12 yards, I have no idea where my arrow is going to hit when I draw back. Its usually never goes in the center/where I'm aiming, and if it does it by pure luck. My arrows are breaking left and right from missing, my crappy blackout bag target really likes to cling to the field points somehow and pull my inserts out constantly. My groupings are barely consistent and when they are, they're always about 10 inches to the left.

Moving closer doesn't help either. My grouping stay the same size, I miss by a foot in any direction and hit a tree or rock. Its so extremely frustrating that I get nearly tunnel vision. I don't have the time or money to get lessons, and even if I could, in my area there's no instructors that I know of.

I don't want to quit traditional archery. In the rare 1 in 50 arrows that actually hits the center, it feels so much better than with a compound (which I consider myself pretty decent with). I don't know what to do, its so frustrating and I just want to be better but after 7 months I cant hit the broad side of a barn from the indoors to save my life.
 

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I've been shooting traditional archery on and off since February. Since then, at 12 yards, I have no idea where my arrow is going to hit when I draw back. Its usually never goes in the center/where I'm aiming, and if it does it by pure luck. My arrows are breaking left and right from missing, my crappy blackout bag target really likes to cling to the field points somehow and pull my inserts out constantly. My groupings are barely consistent and when they are, they're always about 10 inches to the left.

Moving closer doesn't help either. My grouping stay the same size, I miss by a foot in any direction and hit a tree or rock. Its so extremely frustrating that I get nearly tunnel vision. I don't have the time or money to get lessons, and even if I could, in my area there's no instructors that I know of.

I don't want to quit traditional archery. In the rare 1 in 50 arrows that actually hits the center, it feels so much better than with a compound (which I consider myself pretty decent with). I don't know what to do, its so frustrating and I just want to be better but after 7 months I cant hit the broad side of a barn from the indoors to save my life.
Wrong arrows.

1) what length of bow?
2) what poundage limbs?
3) what brace height?
4) what recurve draw length are you?
5) brand and model of arrow (spine rating)?
6) what is the length of the arrow (end of shaft to end of nock groove)?
7) what point weight?
8) feathers or vanes?
9) right or left handed shooter?
10) finger tab or a glove?
11) shooting off the shelf or using a stick on elevated arrow rest?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Wrong arrows.

1) what length of bow?
2) what poundage limbs?
3) what brace height?
4) what recurve draw length are you?
5) brand and model of arrow (spine rating)?
6) what is the length of the arrow (end of shaft to end of nock groove)?
7) what point weight?
8) feathers or vanes?
9) right or left handed shooter?
10) finger tab or a glove?
11) shooting off the shelf or using a stick on elevated arrow rest?
Its a black hunter recurve, 58", 45# limbs. My DL is about 28". Brace height is about 7.5 inches. I use a Gold Tip Warrior, 28" carbon to carbon and a 100 grain point. It has feathers, im a righty with a glove shooting off the shelf. I did order a selfbow for pretty cheap recently because I prefer them after shooting one, and that one is off the knuckle.
 

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If you want help from this forum, at a minimum we need the know the spine of your arrows, and a pic of you at full draw. Better, a video of you taking a shot (or three) if you can manage to post it.

Until then, everything else is speculation.

A quick in-person lesson from a qualified person would help a LOT more than posting here and getting conflicting suggestions from a dozen different people, though.

Bag targets are notorious for snagging inserts. GoldTip inserts do flare out a bit from the shaft diameter. Possible fix would be another brand of insert with a smaller (9/32”) field point, best solution if you’re not hunting would be glue-in target points.
 

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1 A coach or at least an experienced competent shooter to help you would go a long way.

2 A 25 or 30 lb would have been a much better choice for starting.

3 Starting with a bow shorter than 62" is just making it needlessly hard(and longer than 62" would be good.)

4 Shooting with a glove vs tab isnt a big issue. Most would reccomend a tab but this isnt whats holding you back.

5 You didnt say if you are trying to shoot instinctive or gap.


If you arent going to get a coach.
Then at least buy a longer, 25 or 30 lb bow.
Make sure you have a consistent anchor.
Record yourself shooting with your phone to make sure your form is more or less ok and consistent from shot to shot.
Aim at least for now - aim with the tip of the arrow - you need to get yourself shooting consistent. Eliminate the variable of trying to learn instinctive while trying to establish consistent form and release.
 

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Slow down and aim. If you cannot hold the bow back at full draw without shaking, you are overbowed. Put a spot on your target 2 feet below the bullseye, draw anchor and put the point of the arrow on that spot. Once you can get a group that way, you can work on how to move it where you want it to go.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
1 A coach or at least an experienced competent shooter to help you would go a long way.

2 A 25 or 30 lb would have been a much better choice for starting.

3 Starting with a bow shorter than 62" is just making it needlessly hard(and longer than 62" would be good.)

4 Shooting with a glove vs tab isnt a big issue. Most would reccomend a tab but this isnt whats holding you back.

5 You didnt say if you are trying to shoot instinctive or gap.


If you arent going to get a coach.
Then at least buy a longer, 25 or 30 lb bow.
Make sure you have a consistent anchor.
Record yourself shooting with your phone to make sure your form is more or less ok and consistent from shot to shot.
Aim at least for now - aim with the tip of the arrow - you need to get yourself shooting consistent. Eliminate the variable of trying to learn instinctive while trying to establish consistent form and release.
I do have a 68" olympic bow in my closet but it has the same weight limbs. I might just get some 25-30lb ILF limbs if thats the case. Honestly, I got 45# because I draw 70 or 80 without too much issue on compound. From what I gather, thats a common problem. I try to shoot instinctive (Or what I assume to be instintive) where I use a ridge on the riser as a reference point.
 

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Step one: Under the main header read "So you want to get into archery" by Viper1.
Step two: You are overbowed for learning, even if you can bench press twice your weight and do 100 push-ups
Step three: Get some instruction.

Sorry, but unless we can see you and be there, it is difficult to correct your form. Seems like a lot of wrong things are going on. Books such as "Shooting the Stickbow" - Anthony Camera, would be practical help as well. If you are trying to shoot "instinctive" (just a guess) instead, Hold at anchor, aim, follow through (a bit simplistic, but a start).
 

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I do have a 68" olympic bow in my closet but it has the same weight limbs. I might just get some 25-30lb ILF limbs if thats the case. Honestly, I got 45# because I draw 70 or 80 without too much issue on compound. From what I gather, thats a common problem. I try to shoot instinctive (Or what I assume to be instintive) where I use a ridge on the riser as a reference point.

Yes get some 25# ILF limbs. You can get some that will work just fine for $100 or less.

How do you expect to learn to shoot instinctive if you cont have a consistent release and form? Its easy to switch from gap shooting to instinctive. Once you can shoot a group aiming then move on.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thank you all for your advice. I'm going to reduce my weight and probably send a video/photo of my form when I get home.

My last question is, and I know its extraordinarily broad and is reliant on multiple factors, but bear with me, but roughly how long would it take with daily/regular practice to move up from 25-30# to about 55#? Just a rough time frame
 

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Thank you all for your advice. I'm going to reduce my weight and probably send a video/photo of my form when I get home.

My last question is, and I know its extraordinarily broad and is reliant on multiple factors, but bear with me, but roughly how long would it take with daily/regular practice to move up from 25-30# to about 55#? Just a rough time frame
What SPINE RATING are your arrows? It's a 3 digit number...like 400 spine, like 340 spine.
 

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Thank you all for your advice. I'm going to reduce my weight and probably send a video/photo of my form when I get home.

My last question is, and I know its extraordinarily broad and is reliant on multiple factors, but bear with me, but roughly how long would it take with daily/regular practice to move up from 25-30# to about 55#? Just a rough time frame
So you drop down to 20# limbs, and you get the correct SPINE rating on the arrows for 20# limbs,
and you stay with 20# limbs until you can put all fletched arrows into a circle (group size)
inside a 6-inch circle, at 20 yards away.

When you can shoot a 6-inch group (7 ring on a 40 cm target face...Vegas Target Face), with 20# limbs,
then, you goto 24# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 24# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 24# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 24# limbs, then, you go and purchase 28# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 28# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 28# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 28# limbs, then, you go and purchase 32# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 32# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 32# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 32# limbs, then, you go and purchase 36# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 36# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 36# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 36# limbs, then, you go and purchase 40# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 40# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 40# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 40# limbs, then, you go and purchase 44# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 44# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 44# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 44# limbs, then, you go and purchase 48# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 48# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 48# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 48# limbs, then, you go and purchase 52# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 52# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 52# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 52# limbs, then, you go and purchase 55# limbs.

That is NINE rounds of limb changes, each time you change limbs, you are jumping up 4# for limb poundage rating.
That is also NINE rounds of arrow spine changes, and figuring out the correct point weight, that allows you to shoot bareshafts (arrow with NO vanes, no feathers) INTO the middle of the fletched arrow group.

So, figure 6 months for each round of limb changes, IF you shoot weekly, and IF you shoot with the help of a quallified recurve coach...then, call it 54 months to go from 20# limbs to 55# limbs....about 4.5 years.

So, figure 12 months for each round of limb changes, IF you shoot weekly, and IF you go completely on your own, with no help from a qualified recurve coach. So, call it 9 years, if you do it completely on your own.
 

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I do have a 68" olympic bow in my closet but it has the same weight limbs. I might just get some 25-30lb ILF limbs if thats the case. Honestly, I got 45# because I draw 70 or 80 without too much issue on compound. From what I gather, thats a common problem. I try to shoot instinctive (Or what I assume to be instintive) where I use a ridge on the riser as a reference point.
70# bow with 90% letoff means you only hold 10% of the draw weight on the compound bow.
So, 70# bow means 7 POUNDS holding weight.

70# bow with 80% letoff means you only hold 20% of the draw weight on the compound bow.
So, 70# bow means 14 POUNDS holding weight.

70# bow with 70% letoff means you only hold 30% of the draw weight on the compound bow.
So, 70# bow means 21 POUNDS holding weight.

So, you got a 45# recurve bow, and you thought you could CONTROL a recurve bow at DOUBLE your holding weight, or you THOUGHT you could control a recurve bow at TRIPLE your holding weight.

Not a chance, as you have discovered.
And yes, I coach recurve and compound.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
So you drop down to 20# limbs, and you get the correct SPINE rating on the arrows for 20# limbs,
and you stay with 20# limbs until you can put all fletched arrows into a circle (group size)
inside a 6-inch circle, at 20 yards away.

When you can shoot a 6-inch group (7 ring on a 40 cm target face...Vegas Target Face), with 20# limbs,
then, you goto 24# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 24# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 24# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 24# limbs, then, you go and purchase 28# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 28# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 28# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 28# limbs, then, you go and purchase 32# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 32# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 32# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 32# limbs, then, you go and purchase 36# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 36# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 36# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 36# limbs, then, you go and purchase 40# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 40# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 40# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 40# limbs, then, you go and purchase 44# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 44# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 44# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 44# limbs, then, you go and purchase 48# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 48# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 48# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 48# limbs, then, you go and purchase 52# limbs.

You get new arrows that are the correct spine for 52# limbs at YOUR draw length,
and you stay at 52# limbs, until you can shoot 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards. When you are shooting 6-inch groups with fletched arrows at 20 yards, with 52# limbs, then, you go and purchase 55# limbs.

That is NINE rounds of limb changes, each time you change limbs, you are jumping up 4# for limb poundage rating.
That is also NINE rounds of arrow spine changes, and figuring out the correct point weight, that allows you to shoot bareshafts (arrow with NO vanes, no feathers) INTO the middle of the fletched arrow group.

So, figure 6 months for each round of limb changes, IF you shoot weekly, and IF you shoot with the help of a quallified recurve coach...then, call it 54 months to go from 20# limbs to 55# limbs....about 4.5 years.

So, figure 12 months for each round of limb changes, IF you shoot weekly, and IF you go completely on your own, with no help from a qualified recurve coach. So, call it 9 years, if you do it completely on your own.
Lol 9 years doesnt sound super encouraging
 
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