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WASHINGTON – Members of Congress may be alarmed by the surge in Mexican drug violence and its potential to spill across the border, but they grow silent when the talk turns to gun control as a solution.

With related kidnappings and killings occurring in the U.S., the Obama administration is likely to shift dozens of enforcement agents and millions of dollars to the fight against Mexican drug cartels.

Yet when Attorney General Eric Holder suggested reinstituting a U.S. ban on the sale of certain semiautomatic weapons, many lawmakers balked. The 1994 ban expired after 10 years.

"The Second Amendment Task Force opposes the discussed ban and will fight any attempts that infringe on our Second Amendment rights," said Rep. Paul Broun, R-Ga., a chairman of the group. Six Democrats and six Republicans co-signed his statement.

Mexico has long tried to get the United States to curtail the number of guns — many purchased legally — that wind up south of the border, where gun laws are much stricter. The State Department says firearms obtained in the U.S. account for an estimated 95 percent of Mexico's drug-related killings.

"If President (Felipe) Calderon's policies to roll back organized crime are to be successful, we need to defang the power of the drug syndicates to inflict damage upon our state, local and police forces," Arturo Sarukhan, the Mexican ambassador to the United States, said in January. "The best way we can do that is for a real ratcheting up of the United States' capabilities of shutting down the flow of weapons."

That may prove tough to do.

After opposition from the National Rifle Association, 22 Democrats joined Republicans in a Senate vote this month to negate the District of Columbia's tough gun registration requirements and overturn its ban on rapid-fire semiautomatic weapons. More than 80 House Democrats backed a similar measure last year.

The gun lobby has raised more than $20 million for political candidates since the 1990 election cycle, with about 85 percent going to Republicans. That ranks 68th among about 80 industry groups tracked by the OpenSecrets.org campaign finance watchdog.

When border violence comes up in hearings, lawmakers say they don't see a need for new gun laws.

"I don't think the solution to Mexico's problems is to limit Second Amendment gun rights in this country," said Sen. John Cornyn, R-Texas, chairman of the Senate GOP's election committee. "What we can do is help our Mexican friends enforce their own laws."

Republican Rep. Jeff Flake said he believed a recent hearing on Mexico drug violence was actually a discussion of gun control.

"Instead of punishing law-abiding Americans with stricter controls, we must continue to punish those who break the law," said Flake, of Arizona, where 700 cartel-related kidnappings have occurred over two years.

For his part, Obama has signaled a willingness to tighten restrictions on guns, calling the flow of drug money and guns "a two-way situation." Yet 65 Democrats said in a letter to Holder that they would oppose any attempt by the administration to revive a ban on military-style weapons.

Congress did provide $45 million this year for Project Gunrunner, a federal program aimed at curbing the flow of guns. Rep. Ciro Rodriguez, a Texas Democrat on the Appropriations Committee, said he will seek another $30 million over two years for the program and $30 million more to fund efforts by Immigration and Customs Enforcement to crack down on gun trafficking.

Tom Diaz, an analyst at the Violence Policy Center, a gun control group, said cartels use military-style weapons such as the Armalite AR-50, a .50-caliber sniper rifle.

He brought one to a recent congressional hearing — with the help of two police officers — and said he found the weapon on the Internet, bought it for $3,200 from a Maryland "kitchen table" dealer and had it registered in the District of Columbia, all in about six hours.

Semiautomatic rifles used by the cartels are imported legally into the U.S. as "sporting" weapons, a policy that was stopped for years but revived under President George W. Bush. The government could stop importation of those weapons under the 1968 Gun Control Act and thus keep them from winding up in Mexico, Diaz said.

Rep. John Tierney, D-Mass., who chaired a hearing on guns going to Mexico, said he is not seeking widespread gun control but Congress must do something.

"We don't want to get distracted by the gun industry lobby of the NRA trying to talk about (how) every attempt to bring some sanity to the situation is somehow an attempt to get rid of everybody's Second Amendment rights," he said. "That's a red herring."

Sarukhan, the Mexican ambassador, said Mexico simply wants existing U.S. gun laws applied.

"Just on the Arizona and Texas border, there are 12,000 gun shops and countless other gun shows that week in and week out rove around the border area," Sarukhan said.

___

On the Net:

Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives: http://www.atf.gov

Drug Enforcement Administration: http://www.dea.gov
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You forgot to add your opinion of the AP article you pasted. :dontknow:
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
You forgot to add your opinion of the AP article you pasted. :dontknow:
I didn't forget.I just posted it for some to read or comment if they chose to do so.Seems like here latly that the threads of obama and dems wants to take our 2nd amendment rights away from us are never ending and thats just not so.
 

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You mean that limiting our possession of firearms for defense, and letting the aliens sneaking into the country sue us for stopping them at gunpoint won't make us safer?
 

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You mean that limiting our possession of firearms for defense, and letting the aliens sneaking into the country sue us for stopping them at gunpoint won't make us safer?
On the contrary....80% of the guns being used by the aliens in Mexico....come from the US.
 

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On the contrary....80% of the guns being used by the aliens in Mexico....come from the US.

How are they getting into Mexico if they are being purchased legally here in the U.S.? I wonder if Mexico would like to show all those SUVs being used down there, even by their government, that are stolen here in the U.S.
 

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I didn't forget.I just posted it for some to read or comment if they chose to do so.Seems like here latly that the threads of obama and dems wants to take our 2nd amendment rights away from us are never ending and thats just not so.
On the contrary....80% of the guns being used by the aliens in Mexico....come from the US.

Obama has surrounded himself with anti-gun advisors and cabinet members. Emanual, Axlerod, Arne Duncan, Carl Sunstein, Clinton, Holder, Hilda Solis, Lisa Jackson, etc. The only other qualification seems to be an ability to not pay their taxes.

You'll have to post a link to back up your "80%" claim and that "aliens" are using the guns in Mexico. (Illegal/legal aliens not little green men.)

I know of only one case in the U.S. where a gun shop owner has been charged with selling firearms to Mexican drug cartels. One! The cartels are operating a $13 billion dollar per year, tax free, illegal enterprise and they can buy firearms by the boatload from China, Syria, Iran or any of our other enemies. Both U.S. and Mexican news coverage have shown hand grenades and full-auto weapons being confiscated down there and those didn't come from here.

Your Democrat leadership is using the inability of the Mexican government to control the cartels as yet another excuse to disarm honest, law-abiding U.S. citizens.

:cocktail:
 

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Obama has surrounded himself with anti-gun advisors and cabinet members. Emanual, Axlerod, Arne Duncan, Carl Sunstein, Clinton, Holder, Hilda Solis, Lisa Jackson, etc. The only other qualification seems to be an ability to not pay their taxes.

You'll have to post a link to back up your "80%" claim and that "aliens" are using the guns in Mexico. (Illegal/legal aliens not little green men.)

I know of only one case in the U.S. where a gun shop owner has been charged with selling firearms to Mexican drug cartels. One! The cartels are operating a $13 billion dollar per year, tax free, illegal enterprise and they can buy firearms by the boatload from China, Syria, Iran or any of our other enemies. Both U.S. and Mexican news coverage have shown hand grenades and full-auto weapons being confiscated down there and those didn't come from here.

Your Democrat leadership is using the inability of the Mexican government to control the cartels as yet another excuse to disarm honest, law-abiding U.S. citizens.

:cocktail:
As far as posting a link....I'm going by what most go by...it was said on fox news,msmbc and sunday morning.Believe it..or don't believe it.I'm not anti gun...i own over 30 + my father in law owns over 50 that my wife and i will end up with...but in all honest,i don't fear the gov taking our guns away,maybe the state one day,but not the gov.Luckly our state isn't stirring up any crap right now the same as some of the other states.Besides...any gun that i own is strickly a hunting gun...no ak's etc...This world isn't the same one we walked in 10 yr's ago and it doesn't mater if the president is a dem or rep.....the gun issue is not going away...not today,not 5yrs from now.It's easy to sling mud at the dem's.....try slinging it at the thugs who are mis-using the guns that calls for things to be changed.
 

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As far as posting a link....I'm going by what most go by...it was said on fox news,msmbc and sunday morning.Believe it..or don't believe it.I'm not anti gun...i own over 30 + my father in law owns over 50 that my wife and i will end up with...but in all honest,i don't fear the gov taking our guns away,maybe the state one day,but not the gov.Luckly our state isn't stirring up any crap right now the same as some of the other states.Besides...any gun that i own is strickly a hunting gun...no ak's etc...This world isn't the same one we walked in 10 yr's ago and it doesn't mater if the president is a dem or rep.....the gun issue is not going away...not today,not 5yrs from now.It's easy to sling mud at the dem's.....try slinging it at the thugs who are mis-using the guns that calls for things to be changed.

I'm too old to begin believing what "they" say. I've heard far too many lies, cleverly worded non-denial denials and spin doctors pushing their particular agendas. I prefer to gather as much information as I can and then make my own "informed" decision.

My logic tells me that the 80% figure was pulled out of someone's......uhm, thin air unless "they" have actually canvased the drug cartels to see what firearms they have. I don't think anyone has been that brave/stoopid.

(An Obama spokesman just said on FOX that the number is 90%. :rolleyes: )

It is easy to blame the Dems because the current Democrat leadership has an established history of trying to register/regulate/ban/outlaw/confiscate firearms and ammunition. The Democrat party platform called for re-establishment of the Clinton gun ban even though it has been PROVEN not to have had ANY effect on crime.

Manditory 5 year sentencing for anyone using a firearm in a violent crime DOES have an effect on crime but the ACLU believes that takes away from a judges discretion in sentencing. :frusty:

You are correct that the gun issue isn't going away. That's why we must make our opinions know to elected City, State and Federal officials. Tell them that we demand that they pass laws to put the violent criminals in prison and leave them there. If a violent criminal commits 1 crimminal act every week, then there will be 52 less crimes committed each and every year they are behind bars. 5 years means 260 less crimes.

There are millions of gun owners in this country who aren't committing violent crimes and only want to protect themselves as described in the Constitution. Disarming them only creates more opportunities for criminals.

:cocktail:
 

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On the contrary....80% of the guns being used by the aliens in Mexico....come from the US.
Because we have select fire AK's made in China and Russia available for $50 or less? Get real. Do you really think for a second that people who have absolutely no problem with thousands of tons of cocaine, meth, and heroin streaming effortlessly through their country into ours would bother for one second to buy something that's more expensive from the US instead of getting something full auto and much easier to get and cheaper on the world market?
 

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My thoughts I spent 3 years in the active army 10 years in the army reserve and eight years in the national guard. Now every year we spent 2 weeks at summer camp, some of it spent during the Regan Admin. in Honduras. Quite an expense to get units in and out of centeral america for two weeks. Why can we not send the units to the boarder for thier two weeks to keep these idiots south of the border. Seems eazy to me. When I was in Korea thats what we were doing and it worked. And they did it for years in Germany.
 

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This isn't going to happen because of the A.C.L.U. and various and sundrey other "bleeding heart", fuzzy feeling, Utopians who believe the death penalty for murderers, rapests, kidnappers, and other viloent crime advocats ie baby beaters, senior citizen beaters, etc. is inhumaine. But the penalty of death for this type of miscredent is justified.
Never mind, trying to ease their passage into the other demention by making it as painless as possible. Public hanging should be their doom.
 

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To the libs on here....The ATF told the Senators on the investigating committee that the 80% could NOT be substantiated ....in other words it is a LIE. Considering the fact that there are those with in the Mexican Army that are on the payroll of the drug dealers and the huge sums of cash involved....they can get their guns from the Army or else where.....now quit watching CNN !!......:pukey:
 

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........Democrat leadership is using the inability of the Mexican government to control the cartels as yet another excuse to disarm honest, law-abiding U.S. citizens.
^ +1

...and, this is coupled with the inability of the US to control the movement of illegal aliens accross the southern border. We might have the "front door" locked, but they're crawling in through the "windows".

Then, like dchiefransom alluded to, when we catch them crawling in through those "windows", with illegal contraband no less, and use force to stop them, they sue and our hear-anything courts allow it. The ultimate slap in the face to legal, law abiding citizens....much like a lot of the rights illegal aliens have been "given" over the years. We need to somehow "give" them the right to pay taxes (hate to say it) and find a way out of this mess.
 

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....The ATF told the Senators on the investigating committee that the 80% could NOT be substantiated ....
As someone who works in finance and accounting, I always greet numbers with skepticism.

A little dash of common sense goes a long way too....as Silver Pine eloquently pointed out: "My logic tells me that the 80% figure was pulled out of someone's......uhm, thin air unless "they" have actually canvased the drug cartels to see what firearms they have. I don't think anyone has been that brave/stoopid." LOL
 

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When it comes to gun rights, the very last people I will trust are Democrats which 9 times out of 10 are liberal. You can say what you want, but Obama and the overwhelming majority of Democrats are anti-gun.
 

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To the libs on here....The ATF told the Senators on the investigating committee that the 80% could NOT be substantiated ....in other words it is a LIE. Considering the fact that there are those with in the Mexican Army that are on the payroll of the drug dealers and the huge sums of cash involved....they can get their guns from the Army or else where.....now quit watching CNN !!......:pukey:
It's not just the 80% number. One article said there were 12,000 gun shops in the area of the US border with Mexico. 12,000?????????
 

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The one and only case that has brought against a U.S. gun shop for selling firearms to Mexican drug cartels has been dismissed. The State provided no evidence that the shop sold firearms to anyone who couldn't legally own one.

If Holder, Clinton, Obama and the BATFE were actually trying to stop this "alleged" flow of "semi-auto" firearms into Mexico - I'm sure that the cartels will be more than willing to cooperate with the investigation :rolleyes:

Or will the leading CONGRESSIONAL Democrats and Obama appointees look for another phoney excuse to ban/restrict/confiscate firearms in this country.

Maybe Holder, Clinton and Obama (Oh, My!) should be demanding to know where the cartels are buying their hand grenades and rocket launchers. Arizona Slims Pawn and Bait shop? The Alamo dollar store?



....Because the gun buyers all were eligible to acquire firearms, he (the judge) said, their deception did not amount to a "material falsification." Consequently, Gottsfield ruled, the evidence did not show felonious conduct by Iknadosian.

But in mid-trial, all 21 counts were dismissed by Maricopa County Superior Court Judge Robert Gottsfield, who decided he had found a flaw in the government's case.

Gottsfield issued a directed verdict of not guilty for Iknadosian, 47, who was charged with fraud, money-laundering and other offenses.

Gottsfield dismissed jurors and granted acquittal in response to a so-called Rule 20 motion sought by Baker. Under Arizona law, Rule 20 holds that a case must be thrown out if the state's evidence is inadequate for conviction.

"There is no proof whatsoever that any prohibited (firearm) possessor ended up with the firearms," he said.


http://www.azcentral.com/community/phoenix/articles/2009/03/18/20090318guns0318-ON.html
 

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Thank you Silver Pine and Michigan Bob (and others) for showing a great deal of common sense on this issue. It is long overdue that we control criminals and politicians and not guns. If the government becomes strong enough to take away the right to own guns for self-defense, hunting, target competition, etc., then it will be strong enough to take away all of our rights and enslave us all.:eek:
 
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