[UtterButter]

I have a Mathews Creed and I have added a 10" Stinger on the front with a Carter Gizmo QD. The weight on the end is 8oz.
Distance from the riser to where the weights start is 11" and 12" to the end of the weights.
This has really helped my groups and I have a much more steady pin.

I am intrigued by the side bar for hunting only since I don't shoot 3D I would like to but I don't have the time to commit.

Here is what I am considering:
8" Stinger
Stinger side bracket
9oz on the end.

I believe I have followed the equation properly

11" (front stab) x 8oz (front weight) = 88
88" / 9" (side stab with QD) = 9.7oz to be used on my new side stab.

I dont want to go past 8" side bar, based on my tape measure the 8" bar, QD and weights will be really close to my rear line.

Would the 6" be better? That would give me 7" before the weights start (12oz on this since its shorter)

Assuming my math is correct I have a few stupid questions to ask.
1: If I added reverse weights would that simply negate the front weight and simply add overall weight?
2: I assume this will now cause the bow to cant to the left or make me more likely to torque to the left?
3: How will this really assist me? and when? 30+ yards? 50+?


Being winter here I have not shot past 30 yards but at the shop 30yrd range I am shooting 5 spot targets and generally get 2 or 3 X shots and the other shots are within an arrow or 2 diameter from touching the X.
I know this is plenty good for hunting but not a comp shoot.

Since I have no back weight the bow obviously wants to roll forward ward.

I am just trying to really understand what I am gaining or doing for that matter before I invest another $150 for just messing around.

Pros/Cons of this setup???

Here is a pic of the bow as it sits today.

 

[nuts&bolts]

I have a Mathews Creed and I have added a 10" Stinger on the front with a Carter Gizmo QD. The weight on the end is 8oz.
Distance from the riser to where the weights start is 11" and 12" to the end of the weights.
This has really helped my groups and I have a much more steady pin.

I am intrigued by the side bar for hunting only since I don't shoot 3D I would like to but I don't have the time to commit.

Here is what I am considering:
8" Stinger
Stinger side bracket
9oz on the end.

I believe I have followed the equation properly

11" (front stab) x 8oz (front weight) = 88
88" / 9" (side stab with QD) = 9.7oz to be used on my new side stab.

I dont want to go past 8" side bar, based on my tape measure the 8" bar, QD and weights will be really close to my rear line.

Would the 6" be better? That would give me 7" before the weights start (12oz on this since its shorter)

Assuming my math is correct I have a few stupid questions to ask.
1: If I added reverse weights would that simply negate the front weight and simply add overall weight?
2: I assume this will now cause the bow to cant to the left or make me more likely to torque to the left?
3: How will this really assist me? and when? 30+ yards? 50+?


Being winter here I have not shot past 30 yards but at the shop 30yrd range I am shooting 5 spot targets and generally get 2 or 3 X shots and the other shots are within an arrow or 2 diameter from touching the X.
I know this is plenty good for hunting but not a comp shoot.

Since I have no back weight the bow obviously wants to roll forward ward.

I am just trying to really understand what I am gaining or doing for that matter before I invest another $150 for just messing around.

Pros/Cons of this setup???

Here is a pic of the bow as it sits today.

View attachment 1631168

1) get a two way adjustable side rod mount
....this has two hinges...one hinge allows you to swing the side rod like a door
....2nd hinge allows the side rod to swing like an airplane propellor

2) buy whatever length side rod floats your boat
....longer side rod stick, allows you to use LESS weight to get MORE stabilizer power
....shorter stick, requires MORE weight to get the same amount of stabilizer power

3) purchase a box of 100 fender washers, so you can experiment

 

[nuts&bolts]

Here is my rig.

So,
the idea behind a side rod,
is to give something for your bow arm to FIGHT against.

Two bones in your forearm.
So,
some folks like a LOT of side weight, to help them steady up.

So,
some folks like a LITTLE bit of side weight, to help them steady up.

So, two ways to go about this.


FIRST,
set the side rod straight back, parallel to the floor,
cuz we are going to figure out how to tweak the FRONT HEAVY balance first.

So,
let's say you want to play with 10 ounces of weight.

Maybe 2 ounces in front, and 8 ounces in back
or
maybe 3 ounces in front, and 7 ounces in back
or
maybe 4 ounces in front, and 6 ounces in back
or
maybe 5 ounces in front, and 5 ounces in back.

So experiment away
and swap weights around,
to see what YOU like
for a FRONT heavy balance.

Shoot lots of arrows with each setup
and see what gives you the BEST arrow group size.


Then,
we work the door hinge swing angle on the two way mount,
so loosen one bolt and swing the side rod, just like a door.

So,
when you swing the side rod like a door,
FARTHER away from the bowstring,
you make the bow a LITTLE bit side heavy
and this will clean up LEFT misses.

So,
if you still miss left,
then,
try and swing the side rod like a door, a little bit more,
farther away from the bowstring.

This makes the bow MORE LEFT heavy,
and requires MORE effort to keep the sight bubble in the center
and forces you to hold MORE FIRMLY into the wall.

EXPERIMENT with the swing angle (like a door).

When your left misses dis-appear...

then,
then,
experiment with the propellor swing angle hinge.

Swing the side rod down, like an airplane propellor,
so the end weights swing CLOSER to the floor.

See what works BEST for you,
based on the size of your groups.

 

[zmanastronomy]

Man..... I like it when N&B chimes in on a subject. I learn something new every day.

 

[mountainman7]

Man..... I like it when N&B chimes in on a subject. I learn something new every day.

Thats the truth. Im getting ready to setup my stabs when my supra max gets here. This helps me out
tremendously. Nuts and Bolts has already answered several of my questions before and now another.
Helpful people like him is what AT is all about and we are all lucky to have someone with his knowledge
and willingness to help every time we need it. Thanks nuts and bolts.

 

[Tmaziarz]

Check out the weights he has going directly down on the bottum limb, bet you see that alot this year now because of that picture.

 

[Tmaziarz]

What bow is that with a shoot thru riser?

 

[Tmaziarz]

And cables

 

[UtterButter]

N&B hands down answers properly asked questions like the king. Every time he answers a question I realize how much I don't know. At the same time when he answers I start buying stuff!!!!
I really appreciate your replay N&B, you left nothing out!

 

[GrooGrux]

Just looking at N&B's rig makes my arm tired.

Sent from my Galaxy SIII using Tapatalk 2

 

[UtterButter]

N&B is this the type of sidebar bracket you are talking about? http://www.doinker.com/shop/product.php?id_product=185 I assume so since it has both axis..
Any alternatives to this one I should look at?

 

[maxxis88]

What bow is that with a shoot thru riser?

OK archery DS 40?

 

[nuts&bolts]

OK archery DS 40?

Yup.

OK Archery DST 40.

The limb pocket has a special bracket that allows attaching weights to the left
or to the right of the limb bolt...on the bottom or on the top.

 

[fresnohunter]

Is that your chin up bar Alan?

 

[nuts&bolts]

Is that your chin up bar Alan?

For the 18 year old.

My chin up bar is in the garage, attached much higher up.

hehehehehehe.

 

[fresnohunter]

For the 18 year old.

My chin up bar is in the garage, attached much higher up.

hehehehehehe.

:thumbs_up

 

[hunt123]

Just looking at N&B's rig makes my arm tired.

Sent from my Galaxy SIII using Tapatalk 2

Oh yeah. Almost as bad as Reo's. OP, experimenting is everything. You can't get a perfect rig for you by doing math.

 

[bstring]

Forgive my ignorance. Is there some sort of special limb bolt to attach those weights to the bottom like you have on you bottom limb. That would seem to help with leveling out the bow.

 

[ZXT4V]

I think some people like to overcomplicate things. It's my understanding that its meant to offset the weight of your quiver and sight and all the stuff mounted on the opposite side. I personally haven't found a need for one and don't want to spend 100s of $$$ on random stiff just to experiment with. Most of that stuff is designed for paper shooters and is impractical for hunting applications anyway.
If you're shooting good already, I wouldn't worry about it. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

 

[hunt123]

Forgive my ignorance. Is there some sort of special limb bolt to attach those weights to the bottom like you have on you bottom limb. That would seem to help with leveling out the bow.

You can get very similar results with riser weights http://www.paradigmarchery.com/?_escaped_fragment_=base#!base and don't have to have a special bracket on the limb pocket.