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Discussion Starter #1
I recently switched to gap from instinctive shooting. I mainly shoot 3D and recreationally. My point on distance is about 35 yards, which is giving me a gap of 12-14 inches low when I'm shooting in 15-25 yard range that most 3D targets seem to be. This makes it tough to be as consistent as I could be, since that is off most animals bodies, somewhere below it. The worst is when it is a laying target, because then I have to aim at a point on the ground, which is closer to me than the target is. Not sure how to deal with it, but I know that I'm not shooting many 35 yard targets at most 3D shoots. Is it worth adjusting tip weight and possibly my anchor point to get a closer point on distance to help with this?
 

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Is longer arrow an option? I leave my arrows a couple of inches longer than my draw length for this reason.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Is longer arrow an option? I leave my arrows a couple of inches longer than my draw length for this reason.
Unfortunately I don't think so. I'm shooting full length Carbon Express Predator II.
 

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There are two (main) schools of thought with this. One says set the point on distance (POD) to your max distance and then never have to hold over. The other says set the POD to your average distance and try to see if you can have the arrow on the target for all shots.
Current IBO and ASA winners are using #2 for the most part.

The biggest driver of POD is anchor and provided it's not adversely impacting your form that is the only real free lunch. Arrow length, speed and to a subtle degree tuning can get you the rest of the way.
A high anchor with a long, fast arrow is a well known successful combination for 3D.

Grant
 

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P.S. Just saw your arrow comments. Can you measure the total length and weight? The Predator 2 is a rather heavy arrow which could mean slow. A 35yd POD with a slow arrow is very different visually than a 35yd POD with a fast one.

Grant
 

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Discussion Starter #6
There are two (main) schools of thought with this. One says set the point on distance (POD) to your max distance and then never have to hold over. The other says set the POD to your average distance and try to see if you can have the arrow on the target for all shots.
Current IBO and ASA winners are using #2 for the most part.

The biggest driver of POD is anchor and provided it's not adversely impacting your form that is the only real free lunch. Arrow length, speed and to a subtle degree tuning can get you the rest of the way.
A high anchor with a long, fast arrow is a well known successful combination for 3D.

Grant
Thanks, that makes sense. I am anchoring my index finger to the corner of my mouth. Was thinking about switching that to middle finger to the same point. I was previously using a 2nd molar anchor but that wasn't giving me a straight view down the arrow and I was missing left.
 

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I shoot split but with what most people would see as a really I high anchor , my ring finger sits in the corner of my mouth .
I raised it a couple of years ago to get PO down from 52 to 38 ... Still a long way out there for close up stuff , but I set one rig up with heavier , longer arrows recently and it down to 30 yards .

You'll just need to play around with it ...
 

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Discussion Starter #8
P.S. Just saw your arrow comments. Can you measure the total length and weight? The Predator 2 is a rather heavy arrow which could mean slow. A 35yd POD with a slow arrow is very different visually than a 35yd POD with a fast one.

Grant
Total length is 30.5 I believe, including nock and tip. I can measure total weight next time I stop by my archery shop. I'm shooting standard inserts and nocks with 100 grain tips and three 3" feathers.
 

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What spine? Can calculate the weight from that. Also specs on bow and what organization rules you are under would help.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
What spine? Can calculate the weight from that. Also specs on bow and what organization rules you are under would help.
Sorry....that's embarrassing. They're the Predator II 3050 (.491 spine - 8.06 gpi). The bow is a 44#@30" Big River 21st Century style longbow. Not really under any organization rules, just having a good time. I shoot 3 under off the shelf, not interested in a rest or string walking.
 

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360gr or thereabouts, ~8gpp if you are drawing to 30". Likely rather fast with that design (195-200). Makes sense with a fairly tight gap (14") that you were describing.

First option would be the anchor shift. You've got lots of room to play with arrow configuration as well. Slowing them down a touch wouldn't be too terrible and there are longer options as well.

Grant
 

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Discussion Starter #12
360gr or thereabouts, ~8gpp if you are drawing to 30". Likely rather fast with that design (195-200). Makes sense with a fairly tight gap (14") that you were describing.

First option would be the anchor shift. You've got lots of room to play with arrow configuration as well. Slowing them down a touch wouldn't be too terrible and there are longer options as well.

Grant
Thanks for all of your help. I'll try the anchor switch, and possibly go up to 125 grain tips. Just got the predator II because of the low price for now. I'm planning on switching arrows at a later point, when I get this gap shooting thing down and stop banging them off rocks.
 

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No problem but I don't think 25gr will do much besides change the tune a little. Anchor first and perhaps try moving the nock point up a bit.

GT Warrior .400 are very cheap, slightly lighter and 32" raw length. Basically unlabeled Ultralight Entrada. Solid next choice.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
No problem but I don't think 25gr will do much besides change the tune a little. Anchor first and perhaps try moving the nock point up a bit.

GT Warrior .400 are very cheap, slightly lighter and 32" raw length. Basically unlabeled Ultralight Entrada. Solid next choice.
Excellent, thank you. I have an ILF setup coming from Lancaster whenever the new Tradtech stuff comes off backorder, and I'll be starting all over with the gaps and arrows again :confused:
 

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Gaps should be measured at the bow and not at the target. How far is the gap between your arrow and the target, at the bow, when you are pointing 12 to 14 inches below the spot, at the target? Gapping at the target is really pick-a-point, since that is what you are really doing, picking a point to shoot at.
 

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gaps should be measured at the bow and not at the target. How far is the gap between your arrow and the target, at the bow, when you are pointing 12 to 14 inches below the spot, at the target? Gapping at the target is really pick-a-point, since that is what you are really doing, picking a point to shoot at.
this!
 

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Referencing http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1775877
I tell people gap, but I really pick a point. More people understand gap and less people dig into differences between gaps.

I don't gap at bow, but maybe I will give that a try again. I gapped at bow before. I wasn't careful in loading some arrows, and the point left marks on my wood riser. Then I started to use those marks on my riser as reference points. Then I was like, "Why don't I just mark some ruler lines on a masking tape and tape it on?" Then I decided it was probably cheating, deemphasize aiming, and focus on form.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I've never tried to gap at the bow. I'll try it out. For now, I moved my nock point 1/4" higher and it brought my PO down some.
 
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