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I was looking at the new Hoyt bows on their website, and I noticed that the speeds listed state "(ATA)" instead of IBO. Is there a difference between the two, and if so, why would a company change which measurement they use to get their speeds? Is the ATA speed more realistic than the IBO speed?
 

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Hoyt Archery: Maker of the World's Best Bows For those with questions regarding ATA/IBO velocity: ATA speeds are 70 lbs, 30 in. draw at 5 grains per lb. IBO speed is commonly believed to also be tested at 70/30. However, in actuality, the IBO standards allow for speeds to be tested at poundages as high as 82 lbs as long as the arrow is at 5 grains per lb. By going with ATA spec, we eliminate any question as to how we test our speed. REAL SPEED. REAL NUMBERS.
 

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Thanks! That helps some. Most other manufacturers I see list the IBO speed, but they specify that it is at 70# and 30", just like Hoyt, so I don't really see where it makes that much of a difference, except in lighter bows, perhaps.
 

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Actually AMO is 540 grains at 60# and 30" (9 grains per inch). I don't believe it's a misprint, look at 2011 PSE ratings, they use "ATA/IBO" speed rating, if Hoyt was stating "ATA" speeds as being AMO speeds, this would mean the 35" Carbon Matrix would have an "IBO" speed rating of 354 FPS. (please understand not trying to talk bad about Hoyt, just saying I don't think that bow is pushing those speeds). With that being said, the fact that the Carbon Element goes down to 25" draw length has definately got me looking.
 

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corrections on my last for Hoyt 35" Carbon Matrix if it had AMO speed of 318
using following calculations:
318 + 63.08 + 16.6 = 397 FPS "IBO" speed
540 (grains)- 350 (grains) = 190 / 5 = 38 x 1.66 = 63.08 FPS added
70# - 60# = 10# x 1.66 = 16.6 FPS added
 

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This is the comment on Hoyt's facebook page concerning ATA speed.

For those with questions regarding ATA/IBO velocity: ATA speeds are 70 lbs, 30 in. draw at 5 grains per lb. IBO speed is commonly believed to also be tested at 70/30. However, in actuality, the IBO standards allow for speeds to be tested at poundages as high as 82 lbs as long as the arrow is at 5 grains per lb. By going with ATA spec, we eliminate any question as to how we test our speed. REAL SPEED. REAL NUMBERS.
 

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corrections on my last for Hoyt 35" Carbon Matrix if it had AMO speed of 318
using following calculations:
318 + 63.08 + 16.6 = 397 FPS "IBO" speed
540 (grains)- 350 (grains) = 190 / 5 = 38 x 1.66 = 63.08 FPS added
70# - 60# = 10# x 1.66 = 16.6 FPS added
Good math but if you had read post #2 it could of saved you alot of work.
 

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Good math but if you had read post #2 it could of saved you alot of work.
Yeah I know, just seems stupid now, but there was a comment just before mine that stated they believed that Post#2 was a misprint and that they believed Hoyt was using AMO standards. But they also said AMO standards were 540 grains @70# and 30"draw. I guess that post was deleted for some reason.
 

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Hoyt Archery: Maker of the World's Best Bows For those with questions regarding ATA/IBO velocity: ATA speeds are 70 lbs, 30 in. draw at 5 grains per lb. IBO speed is commonly believed to also be tested at 70/30. However, in actuality, the IBO standards allow for speeds to be tested at poundages as high as 82 lbs as long as the arrow is at 5 grains per lb. By going with ATA spec, we eliminate any question as to how we test our speed. REAL SPEED. REAL NUMBERS.
This is the comment on Hoyt's facebook page concerning ATA speed.

For those with questions regarding ATA/IBO velocity: ATA speeds are 70 lbs, 30 in. draw at 5 grains per lb. IBO speed is commonly believed to also be tested at 70/30. However, in actuality, the IBO standards allow for speeds to be tested at poundages as high as 82 lbs as long as the arrow is at 5 grains per lb. By going with ATA spec, we eliminate any question as to how we test our speed. REAL SPEED. REAL NUMBERS.
I read that somewhere.....
 

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I'd like to know if these ATA specs are int their manuals. I just got off their website and there is nothing mentioned about arrow/speed requirements, etc. It may be in one of their manuals, but that costs $30 for non-ATA members. The last I ever heard of ATA requirements was many years ago and it was indeed called AMO at the time. And it was as stated above at 9 gr/lb of draw weight; 60#, 30" draw, and 540 gr. arrow. Bow manufacturers back then listed both AMO and IBO speeds. For isntance a bow might have an AMO speed of 245 fps and an IBO speed of 305 fps. Has the ATA adopted a new policy?

Just to be clear on this neither of these (ATA or IBO) are within the realm of realism. For one thing very few people shoot or should be shooting a 30" draw and the majority can't even draw a 70 lb. bow. And the specs allow for some variances. There should be no variance whatsoever. 30" is 30", not 30 3/4". 70# is 70#, not 73#.

The old AMO specs are not all that accurate either, any more. I don't know of anybody that shoots a 540 gr arrow, especially at 60#.

Personally, I think a nice medium would be to rate bows at 28", somewhere in the middle of what most people shoot. And it wouldn't do any harm to check the bows at both 60# and 70# and publish both numbers. Arrow weight? How about going back to 6 gr/lb for an average.
 

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I'd like to know if these ATA specs are int their manuals. I just got off their website and there is nothing mentioned about arrow/speed requirements, etc. It may be in one of their manuals, but that costs $30 for non-ATA members. The last I ever heard of ATA requirements was many years ago and it was indeed called AMO at the time. And it was as stated above at 9 gr/lb of draw weight; 60#, 30" draw, and 540 gr. arrow. Bow manufacturers back then listed both AMO and IBO speeds. For isntance a bow might have an AMO speed of 245 fps and an IBO speed of 305 fps. Has the ATA adopted a new policy?

Just to be clear on this neither of these (ATA or IBO) are within the realm of realism. For one thing very few people shoot or should be shooting a 30" draw and the majority can't even draw a 70 lb. bow. And the specs allow for some variances. There should be no variance whatsoever. 30" is 30", not 30 3/4". 70# is 70#, not 73#.

The old AMO specs are not all that accurate either, any more. I don't know of anybody that shoots a 540 gr arrow, especially at 60#.

Personally, I think a nice medium would be to rate bows at 28", somewhere in the middle of what most people shoot. And it wouldn't do any harm to check the bows at both 60# and 70# and publish both numbers. Arrow weight? How about going back to 6 gr/lb for an average.
Amen brother, you push it I'll back it, these would be more "real world" numbers and would let you know what you are more likely to expect, BOW MANUFACTURERS OR ANYONE ASSOCIATED WITH THEM PLEASE READ THIS
 

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ttt
 

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I'd like to know if these ATA specs are int their manuals. I just got off their website and there is nothing mentioned about arrow/speed requirements, etc. It may be in one of their manuals, but that costs $30 for non-ATA members. The last I ever heard of ATA requirements was many years ago and it was indeed called AMO at the time. And it was as stated above at 9 gr/lb of draw weight; 60#, 30" draw, and 540 gr. arrow. Bow manufacturers back then listed both AMO and IBO speeds. For isntance a bow might have an AMO speed of 245 fps and an IBO speed of 305 fps. Has the ATA adopted a new policy?

Just to be clear on this neither of these (ATA or IBO) are within the realm of realism. For one thing very few people shoot or should be shooting a 30" draw and the majority can't even draw a 70 lb. bow. And the specs allow for some variances. There should be no variance whatsoever. 30" is 30", not 30 3/4". 70# is 70#, not 73#.

The old AMO specs are not all that accurate either, any more. I don't know of anybody that shoots a 540 gr arrow, especially at 60#.

Personally, I think a nice medium would be to rate bows at 28", somewhere in the middle of what most people shoot. And it wouldn't do any harm to check the bows at both 60# and 70# and publish both numbers. Arrow weight? How about going back to 6 gr/lb for an average.
...HEERE, HEERE...I am down with that BIG TIME :darkbeer:

...stop the hype and "lets get real" :shade:
 

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...HEERE, HEERE...I am down with that BIG TIME :darkbeer:

...stop the hype and "lets get real" :shade:
Explain why, please.
 

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This is the comment on Hoyt's facebook page concerning ATA speed.

For those with questions regarding ATA/IBO velocity: ATA speeds are 70 lbs, 30 in. draw at 5 grains per lb. IBO speed is commonly believed to also be tested at 70/30. However, in actuality, the IBO standards allow for speeds to be tested at poundages as high as 82 lbs as long as the arrow is at 5 grains per lb. By going with ATA spec, we eliminate any question as to how we test our speed. REAL SPEED. REAL NUMBERS.
Just found this about ATA vs. IBO
 

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corrections on my last for Hoyt 35" Carbon Matrix if it had AMO speed of 318
using following calculations:
318 + 63.08 + 16.6 = 397 FPS "IBO" speed
540 (grains)- 350 (grains) = 190 / 5 = 38 x 1.66 = 63.08 FPS added
70# - 60# = 10# x 1.66 = 16.6 FPS added
ATA not AMMO. one is 5 grains per pound, ATA, and Ammo is 9 grains per pound just to clarify it!
 

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What difference does it make? If you shoot a bow at 70lbs, 28 inches through a chrono with a 350 grain arrow (5gr/lb), it'll be pretty close to both ATA and IBO speeds specified at 30 inches if you deduct 10fps for every inch of decrease in draw length. For poundage, for every 10lbs up or down from 70lbs you'd add or subtract 25fps and it comes out pretty close to that too... for every 25 grains of additional arrow weight over 5gr/lb, you'll lose approx 10fps... All this arguing isn't worth the energy spent doing it... it all comes out pretty close to the same number - and that is REAL WORLD #'s.
 

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I don't know the answer, but hoyt bows always shoot faster than the advertised speeds. Mathews always shoot slower if you compare apples to apples. like the new z7 extreme is supposed to shoot 300+ and the CRX 32 is rated at 323. With the exact same arrow of 385 grains, the hoyt is a tad faster. Hmmm, you got me.
 
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