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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is my first time tuning my cams and I have the bow shooting good through paper. I was reading about cam lean and noticed mine seems to have a good amount. This is my VXR at full draw shown. With Matthews are there other ways to adjust cam lean or do you only use the top hats? It is shooting great I just want to make sure the cam lean is not excessive or would cause any issues/if this is normal. I didn’t know if cable twists were used as well on a Matthews or just the top hats. It’s a VXR 31.5 and I just got new gas ghost strings on it so am going through it all. Thank you!
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This is my first time tuning my cams and I have the bow shooting good through paper. I was reading about cam lean and noticed mine seems to have a good amount. This is my VXR at full draw shown. With Matthews are there other ways to adjust cam lean or do you only use the top hats? It is shooting great I just want to make sure the cam lean is not excessive or would cause any issues/if this is normal. I didn’t know if cable twists were used as well on a Matthews or just the top hats. It’s a VXR 31.5 and I just got new gas ghost strings on it so am going through it all. Thank you! View attachment 7623156
Shooting GOOD thru paper is a start.
Fire a group of three fletched arrows and at least ONE bareshaft at 20 yards.

Take a photo.







If you can do this at 20 yards, ignore the cam lean.
If you do not get this result, then you have some work to do with the Top Hats.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Shooting GOOD thru paper is a start.
Fire a group of three fletched arrows and at least ONE bareshaft at 20 yards.

Take a photo.






If you can do this at 20 yards, ignore the cam lean.
If you do not get this result, then you have some work to do with the Top Hats.
Thank you! I appreciate it! So the only way to move cams are with top hats on a Matthews?
 

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To answer your question, yes, only way to work cams is with top hats. But ALL, the Mathews bows with that big bearing, on side of cam, gives floating yoke cable the look of leaning badly. But if you look at your cam, it’s actually not bad at all. I have a Triax. Trx38 and trx36, and all 3 look as yours is doing, but they will shoot a group of bareshafts shaft to shaft at 30 yards. But my TRX 36, I actually tuned better with a slight nock low, on that bow. You can also untwist cables a little if you really wanted to stand cams up more. That way you are taking a little side load off cams, and they will stand up some. A lot of guys want to twist and twist to peak out 70# limbs to 73 and 74# and that can give a lot of load on cams and cause lean.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
To answer your question, yes, only way to work cams is with top hats. But ALL, the Mathews bows with that big bearing, on side of cam, gives floating yoke cable the look of leaning badly. But if you look at your cam, it’s actually not bad at all. I have a Triax. Trx38 and trx36, and all 3 look as yours is doing, but they will shoot a group of bareshafts shaft to shaft at 30 yards. But my TRX 36, I actually tuned better with a slight nock low, on that bow.
Thank you so much! Super helpful to know. This is my first Matthews and first time tuning on my own so I really appreciate it! Really enjoying the Matthews
 

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Socket Man
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Overall, I can see your cam lean in the picture also.

Keep in mind that your bow can produce the same awesome arrow flight with many different tuning methods so your cams can have different amounts of cam lean and your arrow rest can have different placements left or right etc.

This is why when I tune I have fundamental goals that I want to see in my "End Result"!!!!!!

1. I want my arrow rest to be centered on the shelf in a optimal position, I do not want it way off-center

2. I want the least amount of cam lean

3. I want my cams perfectly synced at full draw

So there are the main fundamental things that I always require my bow to meet, I have many more secondary ones also but for this thread I am going to stick with the big dogs.
 

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Socket Man
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So, with your matthews your top cam is leaning right. I do not know what your bottom cam is doing but let me know because depending on how it is leaning changes how I approach this issue.

But the first thing I do with a bow like yours is I set the arrow rest centered on the shelf in that optimal position where I really want it to be in a perfect world and I lock it down and will not be moving it. I am going to tune this bow by moving the powerstroke of the bow left or right by shimming the cams. Now start shooting through paper and if you need to fix some vertical tear move the d loop up or down but absolutely do not even think about the left or right tears. Just move the nock height and clean up the vertical tears.

Now that you have the vertical tears done you can now make the decision to change top hats, we are now ready to move the cams but first lets talk about the fundamentals.

If you are lucky your bow has a left tear because your top cam is leaning to the right, The reason your top cam is leaning to the right is that it is shimmed to the right and putting extra stress on the right limb so by moving the cam to the left by changing top hats you are going to correct some of the cam lean and you are also going to correct some of the left tear.

Now here is where it gets cool, you need to lay a arrow against both of your cams and see if they are both leaning to the right or if just one of them is leaning to the right. Because if only one of them is leaning to the right that is the one you want to change top hats. Do not move a cam that is perfect or already leaning to the left more to the left because it is going to start leaning to the left if you do that. You want to move the cam that is leaning to the right first and play catch up with it. Now once both cams have the same amount of lean then I totally move both of them at the same time.

So it is your job to study your cams and choose which one is needing to play catch up first or my cams are identical and I can move both of them at the same time.

So if you are lucky and the bottom cam is already perfect with no cam lean and you top cam is leaning to the right you can fix your left tear and clean up the cam lean by just moving the top cam over to the left a little with the top hats.
 

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Socket Man
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I am pretty happy with how I typed up that concept, I have typed it out hundreds of times so I am getting better at it. This simple approach can give you a very clean final setup for your bow, like I said you can leave your cams alone and end up with awesome arrow flight but to me anytime you ignore cam lean and just move the arrow rest as your method it is just a lazy choice.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I am pretty happy with how I typed up that concept, I have typed it out hundreds of times so I am getting better at it. This simple approach can give you a very clean final setup for your bow, like I said you can leave your cams alone and end up with awesome arrow flight but to me anytime you ignore cam lean and just move the arrow rest as your method it is just a lazy choice.
Wow! That could be in a book! Thank you so much. I’ll check my bottom cam later today and let you know. Of the three you mention I did sync my cams to hit together and centered rest at 13/16. The cam lean is now the only thing I’m not sure of. I’ll check this today and follow up thank you again!!!

-Kyle
 

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Socket Man
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Now, with this bow once you have gotten rid of some of the cam lean and both cams are freaking sweet and you have cleaned up 95% of the left tear then to finalize and nail down perfect arrow flight if you want to bump the arrow flight a fraction of a inch then bump away, yes you can mess with the top hats and get there also but in the end making that last micro adjust either by shimming the cams or bumping the arrow rest is perfectly fine.

On many bows before I bump the rest I will as a final attempt I will change the cable guide and see if that does the job so I don't have to bump the rest.

Actually, that brings up a couple things I like to do when tuning a bow that is cam shim only. With a yoke tune bow I don't because yoke tuning is so freaking easy compared to shimming. But when I am tuning a shim bow I will turn my nock on the tuning arrow and correct as much of the poor arrow flight with the arrow as possible because this decreases the amount of shimming or arrow rest moving I have do do to hide the arrow issue. Secondly, I have found that by moving the cable guard so the fletching has very little clearance from hitting the cables on the way by also decreases the amount of shimming or yoke tuning I have to do. If you have a quarter inch or more of clearance between the fletching and cables that means they are being pulled over a long ways and this tension is causing you to have to tune heavily somewhere else.
 

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Only thing with these bows and top hats, you can only do but so much. Each set of top hats, (3 sets), is a total of .175”. So you have a set that Is 1. .140” + .035”
2. .120” + .055”
3. .100” + .075”.
so with those sets, you can have wide on left side and thin on right, or vise versa. But they must stay as a set to equal a total of .175”. That limits you more do than with yokes, and or a bow that has shims of .010”, .015 and so on. When you can move a cam .010” and then a 1/2 twist in a yoke, and then move you cable rod a 1/32” , you can really micro tune cams. But with these top hats, a .035” is as small of a move as you can get. So you may have to touch rest over in one or the other direction more than you normally would want to. But, still, I haven’t seen one that you can’t tune down the pipe, or very very close to it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Only thing with these bows and top hats, you can only do but so much. Each set of top hats, (3 sets), is a total of .175”. So you have a set that Is 1. .140” + .035”
2. .120” + .055”
3. .100” + .075”.
so with those sets, you can have wide on left side and thin on right, or vise versa. But they must stay as a set to equal a total of .175”. That limits you more do than with yokes, and or a bow that has shims of .010”, .015 and so on. When you can move a cam .010” and then a 1/2 twist in a yoke, and then move you cable rod a 1/32” , you can really micro tune cams. But with these top hats, a .035” is as small of a move as you can get. So you may have to touch rest over in one or the other direction more than you normally would want to. But, still, I haven’t seen one that you can’t tune down the pipe, or very very close to it.
This makes a lot of sense. Didn’t realize it wasn’t as fine with top hats but it sure is an easy system!
 
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