Could be your rest needs moved a small amount. Could just be you need a slight sight adjustment. Try to sight in on a 1” strip of tape at 30 yards. Run the tape vertical and adjust so groups are centered on tape. Then move up and see if things stay centered. Forget 10 yards, just gives false readings due to a wide range of adjustments doesn’t move your POI much.

 

If you know it is a form issue, then shoot at vertical lines on a target, instead of shooting for a bullseye...... lot easier to shoot at a line


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Possible causes:

Bow cant, center shot off, bubble on sight off.

There are many other causes also such as torque of bow, fletching contact, etc.

I would try a walkback tune and see what happens.

 

ok, before you go moving your rest, do the correct adjustment, which is the sight. you said you had bullet holes, so leave the rest alone, for now.

how perfectly centered are your shots at 10? move the entire sight housing to correct the 4" left at 30 so they hit perfect(it will be a small adjustment), recheck at 10, spoiler alert, it wont be a noticable change.

 

Walk back tune, whisker biscuit paper tunes too easy. The full contact of the whiskers straightened the arrow.

 

Paper tuning gets you started but it sounds like you need to do a walkback tuning session and make SMALL tweaks to the rest until the gradual drift is removed. This is assuming your form is good, you aren't torquing or canting the bow.

And like others have said, shoot at tape lines not bulleyes. Do elevation or windage first, then the other. Just did that today for a new bow and it went a lot smoother than in past years when i've tried to shoot dots.

 

Thanks for AL the responses.

I think I'll adjust the block of the sight to get on track at 30 yards.

This seems like the simplistic fix for now. It makes sense that I probably won't see much movement at 20 and 10.

Main goal is to get consistent with my groups before this deer season. As time progresses, I'll paper tune again and probably upgrade the sight someday.

This is a lot different than 20 years ago and hunting with a barebow. Form first for ethical kill shots

 

No offence to any one who's mentioned walkback tuning or a possible centershot problem but........you're wrong. Yes moving your rest could potentially put the arrows on a vertical line as you move back but only because it puts the rest and sight on the same line. However, you can do the same thing by moving your sight, which is what you should do to sight in. That's why it's called "sighting in" and not "resting in". The problem with walkback tuning is that if you've already tuned the bow, you're paper tuned, so moving your rest would degrade the quality of your arrow flight while moving your sight would not.

This is where people miss the mark, pun intended, when sighting in. They sight in at their shortest distance and think that because they're "on" at that distance, that they'll be "on" as they step back. This is absolutely true. However, at short range, you can actually be quite a ways off target but still hit what you're aiming at. As you move back, you begin to notice that you're not as "on" as you thought. This is why you want to sight in your windage at the furthest distance that you can hold a reliable group.

This is all assuming that your sight axes are level and you're not shooting in a lot of crosswind.

 

like some one mentioned, if your sight has a bubble, make sure the bow in vertical before you shoot.

 

Sight does have a bubble. Problem is that it's outside of the ring on the bottom.

While focusing on the pins, it's hard to look at. Maybe I need to focus on the bubble first, then locate the pin.

I have noticed better sights with the bubble inside the ring. Definitely going to upgrade at some point.

 

Site in at 50 yards. Then shoot at 3 yards using your 50 yard pin. You want your 50 yard pin to hit the same vertical line at both 3 yards and 50 yards. Just be aware, if you need to make adjustments to get both hitting the same line, you need to adjust in micro movements. When you are done, you will most likely still be shooting as good hole thru the paper. If not, adjust your poundage up/down a little to correct the spine.

 

Not all advise on AT is good. Some advise is good. Watch a Youtube video on "walk back tuning" or "French tuning." This is where I would start.

 

"...only other thing that I can think of after shooting today was that it was pretty breezy, almost windy..."

I would probably start with this right here.......

And, not trying to be a total "Richard" here, but if 20-40% [1-2 out of 5] of your shots are generally flyers, do you ethically feel ready to try to take a shot at an animal this year? Would hate to read a "I Wounded a Buck" thread...

Thanks for your input in advance.

NW[/QUOTE]

 

"...only other thing that I can think of after shooting today was that it was pretty breezy, almost windy..."

I would probably start with this right here.......

And, not trying to be a total "Richard" here, but if 20-40% [1-2 out of 5] of your shots are generally flyers, do you ethically feel ready to try to take a shot at an animal this year? Would hate to read a "I Wounded a Buck" thread...

Thanks for your input in advance.

NW

[/QUOTE]

I don't disagree with you on this. I'm working on strength training and form to get a consistent shot. 30 yards is where it's most prevalent in terms of fliers. Not until I work that out will I shoot past 20.

I'm a meat hunter, not a trophy hunter. If there is a ginormous buck at 30, then I will pass up the shoot until I get all arrows in a group.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCiTPJrCNA8

John Dudley offers the easiest explanation and steps to simple walk-back tuning.

 

I've seen that before but totally forgot about it. Thanks!

 

Guessing by your want to shoot 5 arrows that you are a precision rifle shooter. I am rifle shooter as well as a avid archer and have found that 3 good shots, then take a break and walk to the target will eliminate fatigue over the course of your shooting.

As you are a new archer that believes you can tell a bad shot as soon as fired, I'm guessing that you are PEAKING immediately after the shot. This can cause allot of frustrating errors. Be patient and continue to follow through the shot, just like golf.

Since you arent mixing broadheads into the equation, I don't think your rest will be the issue as field points should still group and easily stabilize if your rest is slightly off.

 

Guessing by your want to shoot 5 arrows that you are a precision rifle shooter. I am rifle shooter as well as a avid archer and have found that 3 good shots, then take a break and walk to the target will eliminate fatigue over the course of your shooting.

You aren't too far off... LOL.

I agree with the fatigue factor for sure and have thought about this.

Last couple of times I have shot, the first two rounds are pretty well spot on with 0-1 flyer.

I keep shooting through the fatigue to try to build stability in my arms. Also trying to slowly build up my shoulder as I have had some minor issues with it through the years. Ultimately I'm taking 2-3 days in between rounds to allow for recovery.

As time has progressed, it's getting easier to draw and hold. Consistently at 60 lbs. I might add another turn to the limbs, but I would rather be stable and comfortable at 60 rather than jack it up to 70.

The great thing is that shooting a bow is helping my accuracy with my slug gun in a standing position. Getting 3" groups at 200 yards... 😉

 

1. Sight in your bow at 40 yards when doing your windage and use a vertical piece of black tape on cardboard, this will help you tremendously.

2. If your arrow flight is really really bad then the first few feet out of the bow the arrow will be correcting itself and then arrow will take off in a funny direction different than when it first left the bow. So your need to have the bow tuned at least good enough that this effect is minimal.

3. If you are simply pulling the trigger and you are getting some amount of flinching or jerking on many of the shots you take then until you work on your execution and get rid of them you will simply have fliers.

Out of the three areas shooting at 40 and dialing in the windage is the one that you don't really need to make any changes but the other two you are going to have to learn how to tune using one of the many methods and then with the shot execution you have to commit to shooting with a surprise release where you stop just pulling a trigger. We can help you in these two areas to learn the methods of tuning and shooting if you want.

 

I’m assuming your right handed? Possibly holding the bow a little to tight with the left hand which tends to cause erratic left movement from hand tourque that you may not even notice your doing therefore the further out you go the more your noticing. It can always be something very simple to fix just a suggestion. Don’t get frustrated always amplifies the problem it seems lol. Good luck and good to hear not willing to fling an arrow at an animal until confident.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

My mentor has always preached shoot through fatigue. If planning on shooting a 30 Target course practice shooting 60 arrows. Kind of same idea as shooting 50,60,70 yards out then coming into 20,30 yds and being amazed how much more confident you are at those distances.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Your sight is not the main problem, it may be a little off, but not a lot. It has nothing to do with your level either unless you are shooting uphill and downhill. Under 50 or 60 yards on flat ground the bubble doesn't matter a whole lot. It's the rest. Definitely need to walk back tune. If it was purely the sight you would be hitting off pretty much the same at all distances. You know your center shot is off when at each further distance you hit further off the target. Just because the bow is paper tuned doesn't mean it's the most forgiving set up for you. In my opinion paper tuning is just a starting point. Walk back tuning makes the set up more forgiving for your personal shot style. After walk back tuning is complete you could also group tune at a longer distance you are comfortable with like 50 or 60 yards. Shoot groups of arrows playing with rest elevation until you find the sweet spot where your groups are tightest.

 

Your sight is not the main problem, it may be a little off, but not a lot. It has nothing to do with your level either unless you are shooting uphill and downhill. Under 50 or 60 yards on flat ground the bubble doesn't matter a whole lot. It's the rest. Definitely need to walk back tune. If it was purely the sight you would be hitting off pretty much the same at all distances. You know your center shot is off when at each further distance you hit further off the target. Just because the bow is paper tuned doesn't mean it's the most forgiving set up for you. In my opinion paper tuning is just a starting point. Walk back tuning makes the set up more forgiving for your personal shot style. After walk back tuning is complete you could also group tune at a longer distance you are comfortable with like 50 or 60 yards. Shoot groups of arrows playing with rest elevation until you find the sweet spot where your groups are tightest.

The 2nd axis on a sight level absolutely matters on flat ground, if you're paying attention to it. Also, if your sight is off on windage, you will not hit the same amount off at 10 as you would at 20 or 30 or 40 or 50. In fact, at 10 yards, you'd be off just 1/5th the amount as at 50 yards. If you're off 1' at 10 yards, you'll be off 5" at 50 yards. That's just geometry. Triangles. 7th grade math. The further you move back, the longer the 2 sides of a triangle are, the longer the third side is.

Here's a quick picture. Green line is the target line, red line is the line your arrow travels on and is only 2 degrees off of the green line, short blue line is half way to the target, long blue line is at the target. Notice how the short line is exactly half as long as the long blue line. The further you move away from the target, the further you will miss the target. You will NOT miss by "pretty much the same at all distances".

 

Oh my god :BangHead:

 

Since you are already paper tuned and bare shaft tuned, walk back tuning is not going to benefit you. More than likely it's a sight issue or a form issue. Sight in at 30 yards to hit dead center. Then go back and shoot at 10 and 20 yards. I bet you are still dead center! A small deviation at 10 yards will open up even more at 30, and 40 yards. You may only be off 1/4 inch at 10 and 3-4 inches at 30 and even more at 40, especially if you are using a larger sight pin size. I usually only shoot at 10 yards initially to get the arrows on target. I usually start setting my sights at 30 yards and 40 yards. I then move back to 20 and set that mark for my pin. I only use single pin slider/dial sights so it makes it a lot easier to get things dialed in precisely. Once I get my 20, 30, and 40 yard marks set, I select the tape that corresponds to those distances or make my own from a blank. Many times, I have to make a tiny windage adjustment at longer distances (60+) for even more precise shooting, but the shorter distances are still spot on.

 

Just like a car crash with cherries going . I had to look , just what i thought . :happy1:
Loosen your grip and sight it in . Sounds like a form issue ?

 

Huntisker is doing all the work in this thread so I don't have to, thanks man.

 

Any bow that has a arrow that is coming out crooked is going to have a porpoising effect and the fletching has to correct the problem so as the fletching gets that job done there is no guarantee that the arrow is going to stabilize and go in the same direction that it left the bow. Then once it stabilizes it is going to travel in a straight direction for the rest of the trip to the target.

So yeah it is possible for a bow to have a poor arrow flight issue right out of the bow and the fletching corrects the problem and the arrow travels in the same direction as when the arrow left the bow. Yeah it is possible for the arrow to leave the bow poorly and by the time it is corrected it travels in a different direction than when it left the bow.

 

Now if you are a walk back tuner or a french tuner you basically ignore arrow flight and you pay attention to point of impact, most walk back and french tuners cheat and shoot through paper to get a general amount of decent arrow flight to begin and then they start messing with the rest to get that point of impact results they are looking for.

I never did like that approach, I just didn't want to ignore the arrow flight at all. That is why I do my tuning with bare shafts and I get my bow to the point where it can shoot bullet holes from 0ft all the way to 20 yards. Why? Because this means that my fletching has nothing to correct, my fletching can simply stabilize the perfect arrow flight and spin the arrow.

 

Update..


So I went out this evening, shot two groups of three right away and they were spot on.

I focused on my "follow through" on those shots basically keeping it on target.

As the sun was setting though, I noticed on thing. I have a slight stigmatism in my shooting eye and the glow of the pins were creating a halo or blur making the pin look double.

So, not going to be shooting too early or too late in the day. With plenty of light it's not too noticeable.

I also went to the optometrist earlier in the week and she bumped up my prescription a tad in my right eye. I might go back and get corrective lenses for the stigmatism. She initially said that it wasn't enough to use a specialized lens, but I think I'm going to push for it.

 

I think it has been said what yer doing is peaking in other words watching the flight of yer arrow by either moving yer bow arm to the left slightly or yer head. I used to have the same problem till I learned to follow through its hard to break the habit of watching the arrow fly to the target. Just my two cents on this and could be that simple

 

I wouldn't necessarily say peaking, but I do think I was moving the bow left for sure.

I remembered that my sight was to the left after the shot when I was basically grouping to the left.

Last night, my first few sets of shots, I made sure to keep the bow on target and grouped them just below the center of the target, which they were all low to begin with.

I was really focused initially on getting back tension and pulling through the shot. This I think was pulling my elbow too high out of alignment with the arrow and torquing the bow to the left. Once I went back to relaxing my back and arm a bit, and focus in keeping the bow on target, then I think I corrected the issue.

After those first couple of groups though I was all over the place as my pins got brighter with the sun setting and my astigmatism started to kick in.

Hopefully I can have my son shoot pics of me shooting this weekend and maybe have you guys critique my form as long as you guys be nice.... 😄

...