[Reverend]

Been there, done that...

By the way, yes...
Cams are synched
Played with timing, purposely mis-timing
I've tried moving rest far left, far right, and in between
Adjusted the poundage up and down (ACC 3-49, 27 in., 100 gr. tip)
Played with timing on fall away
Adjusted the hand position on the grip in, out, relaxed, tight...
Moved nocking point up... down
Checked for nock pinch with loop
Powder tested for fletch contact. Arrow is clean
Bare shaft tested...

But still, in all cases and with every adjustment, I get the same result; tail left tear.

This is why I suspect cam lean to be a possible cause.

 

[hdrat]

poor paper tear

What is your bow set up?. Lbs.,d. l., let off.

 

[Brown Hornet]

Do you have the one piece wood grip on? Take it off if you do....they aren't always straight and will cause a tear that won't change....went through that on my buddies Vectrix and his Katera.

Do NOT serve the yoke....just adjust the opposite side of the tear....but I would shoot it without the grip first.

 

[NoSecondBest]

Do you have the one piece wood grip on? Take it off if you do....they aren't always straight and will cause a tear that won't change....went through that on my buddies Vectrix and his Katera.

Do NOT serve the yoke....just adjust the opposite side of the tear....but I would shoot it without the grip first.

Brown Hornet: You have to serve the yoke or you can't do any adjusting. It will just shorten but won't put any pressure on a specific side.

 

[Reverend]

Do you have the one piece wood grip on? Take it off if you do....they aren't always straight and will cause a tear that won't change....went through that on my buddies Vectrix and his Katera.

Do NOT serve the yoke....just adjust the opposite side of the tear....but I would shoot it without the grip first.

Thanks for input BH and others...
There's no grip. I use the side plates.
This is what I don't understand, if I adjust one side of the Y yoke, without serving it, won't the floating effect undo the effects? Isn't this only used to adjust the timing? Help me understand this?

 

[-bowfreak-]

What is your setup? What rest are you shooting? Does the cam seem to be leaning bad? I really doubt that "normal" cam lean is your problem. What I mean by that is, I don't think you could take it out with a static yoke adjustment. Maybe the axle holes are drilled wrong? I don't know? Give us more information if possible......maybe something will click with somebody.

 

[CoppertoneSPF15]

Two things to try:

1. Take a look at the shim washers on either side of the cams. Can you see any gaps between the washer/cam/inner limb face? If so, you'll need to go pick up some nylon washers. You can find them at Ace Hardwares. Osh has it too.

On the bottom cam, the thinner washer should be on the left and the thicker washer on the right. On the top, the two washers are about the same thickness. The one of the right is a hair thicker I think. Can't remember off the top of my head.

2. Try swapping the limb halves. Left to right on top and bottom. While swapping the limb halves, check to make sure the limbs were seated properly and if there's any play once fitted into the pocket. There shouldn't be any.

See if either of those changes anything.

 

[denn10]

on top of this have you used an arrow or something to put on the side of the cam and see if its off?? on a draw board you can check at full draw, i would suggest actually checking this at rest and full draw to see if there is cam lean since you never said you actually put in a draw board and at rest and checked.

 

[Brown Hornet]

Brown Hornet: You have to serve the yoke or you can't do any adjusting. It will just shorten but won't put any pressure on a specific side.

Not true....the set I just took off wasn't served.....and a lot of Hoyts big guns don't have theirs served. I know Cousins doesn't....Braden doesn't....Reo doesn't....pretty sure Jesse and Shane don't....Jamie V doesn't

You don't need to twist one side to the moon and back to get it right....it's usually only a few twist difference. If it's not....and you have a floating yoke...something else is off.

 

[Brown Hornet]

Thanks for input BH and others...
There's no grip. I use the side plates.
This is what I don't understand, if I adjust one side of the Y yoke, without serving it, won't the floating effect undo the effects? Isn't this only used to adjust the timing? Help me understand this?

Don't worry about what the floating part is doing.....

Start over....put even twist in each side....say 6. Then add a few more to the sight side. Check the timing....shoot it through paper.

 

[Reverend]

Thanks for replies. I'll try what was suggested, and post progress. I'm not new to bow tuning, but this bow is giving me some difficulty. The interesting thing is that it was shooting fine (bullet holes) when I first got it. Now something has gone awry. For general info:
RH 28 in. Vect XL
60#
GK Platinum Premier, with horse shoe launchers set up as drop away.
WC strings
String leeches on strings and cables
27 in. ACC 3-49 with 100 gr. tips.
A2A in spec. 35 1/2 in.
BH 7 3/8 in. Keep in mind that this measurement is to riser as I have sideplates and not the standard one-piece grip.
75% LO

 

[Reverend]

Update:

Last night I saw a hairline gap between bottom cam and limb, so I removed the cam, and added a shim to fill up the space. While I was at it, I decided to swap limbs. All limbs are tight, correctly seated and axles are straight.
After customary adjustments to get timing correct, I tried paper tuning again. Guess what? Still nock left tear! Arrrggghhh!

Tonight I'll try twisting the right side of the yoke a few times and see what happens. I'm assuming that I will twist one side, then re-time the cams, and finally test shoot through paper again...

I'll keep you posted...

 

[vulcan320]

On both my V-tec and Vulcan I was able to put differing twist amounts on either side of the floating yoke to straighten cam lean. They don't have the original strings anymore. The twists haven't "equalized" after many shots and times in the press. Hope it works the same for you.:smile:

 

[nccrutch]

Use a static yoke and add 2 twists to the lt-side (string side). Add more if needed. The tear will go away.

 

[Hoyt Thompson]

Ok I guess I need to chime in here.

A floating yoke can be tuned like a static.

As long as you retain pressure on the main cable, seating the yoke in the crease it will remain "static".

One thing you can do to start is press the bow and pull the main cable in a left OR right fashion as you relax the press to help it "center".

After that you can add twists to one leg of the yoke by keeping it tight as you twist. There may be some equalization over say 200 shots but then it usually stays put.

Also one thing to remeber this is not a dual cam systen where all the lean can be "yoked out", there is one yoke and the botton will have lean reguardless seeing the cables are being pulled in a certain direction by the cable guard. The top cam will need to be tuned to the bottom cam.

I believe this is why Hoyt may use a Floating Yoke. One it is simply a stronger yoke(not saying that a Static is weak just that a floater is stronger) and two if you have to many twists in one side then it has no choice but to equalize. A creased main string is only going to hold so much tension before it allows twists from one side to slip by the crease to the other side.

reverend, I am sure you will get this figured out as you always do. I would add a few twists in the yoke leg on the left side while retaining pressure on the yoke leg so that the twists stay on the left side. This should help providing you are not getting interference from anything else. Keep us posted and let see if we cant get you running true.

 

[Reverend]

Thanks for input. I didn't get a chance to play with it last night. You know the Lord's work takes precendence :wink:. But I hope to jump into it today, perhaps tomorrow.
I guess I can clip the yoke with one of those acco clips to prevent one side from slipping or equalizing. Furthermore, as I'm thinking about whether or not the yoke will equalize over time, I suppose I can mark the yokes with some whiteout or something and check it periodically to see if it moved from the reference point.

BTW Thinking about the static versus floating; if the floating yoke will not move, then what is the real benefit of it over a static one?

 

[revwilder]

Hey Rev,
The only positive of the floating yoke is the strength, since it has more strands unlike the static which separates the cable in half.

I know H&M Bowstrings serves his floating yoke to make it static.

God Bless, Keep up the good work for the Lord. Knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord.

 

[Hoyt Thompson]

Thanks for input. I didn't get a chance to play with it last night. You know the Lord's work takes precendence :wink:. But I hope to jump into it today, perhaps tomorrow.
I guess I can clip the yoke with one of those acco clips to prevent one side from slipping or equalizing. Furthermore, as I'm thinking about whether or not the yoke will equalize over time, I suppose I can mark the yokes with some whiteout or something and check it periodically to see if it moved from the reference point.

BTW Thinking about the static versus floating; if the floating yoke will not move, then what is the real benefit of it over a static one?

Cause most of the time you can slap on a floaterand it sets itself.

Some have found going from a 8" floater to a 10" makes a bit of difference.

The key points of a floater is its strength, its ability to no let on side be real short and the other real long, and its simplicity. 85% of floater users will not have a problem with it.

The clip may not be a great idea as the yoke may slip a bit if you have to many twists on one side. The friction applied tot heyoke at the crease will only hold so many twists to one side before physics take over and starts to allow them to slide by to the other side.

You will get this, you said it was shooting great before so it has probably just settled some.

If you do want to play with the static idea you can serve up about 3/4" from the junction of the main string and yoke. just make sure to center the yoke string first. This way if you do not like it then you can snip it off and return to a full floater.

 

[-bowfreak-]

All of this info is very good. I am keeping up with the thread for my own benefit. You can never know enough as far as I am concerned. Anyway.....is there a possibility that you could have a cracked top right (or bottom left I guess) limb? The yoke being a problem is new to me with Hoyts. I have never had an issue with any Hoyt I have ever owned with the floating yoke. Hoyt Thompson makes a good point, I just personally have never seen it happen.

Keep us informed.