I call BS on not being able to call your shot. I do not want my bow moving that fast.

 

I call BS on not being able yo call your shot. I do not want my bow moving that fast.

I believe his argument would be that you need to train yourself to accept it. Once you accept it, focus on the centre, pull through the shot, and bam X every time.

 

It may work indoors but when u add in a little wind, I’ll take a little extra weight out front.

 

But with a lighter bow even if it goes blown slightly more off target, you'll get back that much quicker. Right?

 

With proper form you should have no trouble calling your shots with a heavy or light bow.

The reason for the large front and the V bar rear stabilizer is that it balances the bow and will help it stay on target that last second. From there, with proper form your bow will move.

 

With proper form you should have no trouble calling your shots with a heavy or light bow.

I have several bows, and I've worked my way through, ????, lots of others over the last 60 years.

I don't always get the pin to the dot, but the shot almost always lands where the pin was.

Bow points, 100. Shooter points < 100. The shot always lands where I pointed it, even when I didn't want to point it where it landed.

Oh well

 

My thought is that theory will work well with a 90% let off bow. Start holding 21 pounds at full draw and you really need some weight to counteract the force you're putting against the system.

I think his theory still makes sense though. If you have a big bobble with a heavy bow, it takes longer to return to center. I think the idea is shoot a bow that's light enough to naturally return quickly to your point of aim. A little weight is needed for a high holding weight bow.

 

 

More than one way to skin a cat! I like my hunting bow heavy because I like a slow float and I never get to far off cuz it moves slower! I currently have 12" stab up front with 7oz and a 6 " side bar with 4oz and might add more before I'm done!

 

But if you train your mind to accept a fast float, you will be better. I think.

 

I don't think his point makes sense mathematically. Thought experiment incoming.

Imagine a 3D bell curve (take a 2D bell curve and rotate it around to draw one in 3 dimensions). Take the center as what you are targeting and the height of the bell curve at any point as the probability of your pin floating to that point.

You form this 3D bell curve by filming your pin float, let's say.

It doesn't matter at what speed your pin is moving: the distribution is the distribution. It doesn't matter at what "speed you play this film", the distribution does not change.

It's like, in way, he's saying if you flip coins fast then you have different odds of head or tails than if you'd flipped them slowly.

 

Id be lying if I understood your theory, but that doesn't mean its wrong. That being said, it's important to understand the underlying basis of his concept, which is that your brain is always going to bring the pin back to centre subconsciously. Visual proprioception. So the lighter the bow, the faster that process happens. It's also of note that he's not saying you shouldn't try to minimize the deviance from centre. If it moves really fast all around the 10 rings that's obviously better than moving really fast between the 10 and 9 ring.

 

There's no doubt Mr Turner is a helluva coach and shooter of all things that launch projectiles.

I believe HIS methods work for some people. I don't believe they work for everyone. Just like my methods work for me but not for others....Example:

I shoot an index release and I activate it with back tension. But, rather than aiming and pulling harder through the shot, I use my fingers to hold the wrist strap in place with a good amount of force, to activate the release, I aim and slowly relax the fingers on the strap. As I relax my grip, the string tries to pull the strap off my wrist, pulling it against my "trigger finger". Most everyone that I explain this to, has a look of bewilderment. I found for ME, this allows me to have a more uniform/repeatable pressure against the stops.

I KNOW, I can't shoot a bow with large and fast pin float. If my pin/dot moves too much and/or way too fast, I end up commanding/forcing the shot which results in poor scores.

As with any coach, you should find something to take home with you after the session. His approach to the mental aspect of archery is pretty amazing. Even then, his words might not have the same effect on you as it did on Bodie...

 

It kinda jives with Griv’s seminar at the ATA this year. He the weight on bars primary benefits are preventing the bow from moving after the release breaks, not to assist with aiming.

I don’t think, and maybe I’m wrong, that Joel meant no weight at all. However I do think he’s saying you do r need 10oz out front and 30oz out back. Bodie I believe runs like 3 out front and 6 in back.

in terms of calling your shot, I’ve found for me that if I can’t it was probably a good shot. I think this is because on those shots my mind was on the right place: technique instead of trying to hold the pin steady.

Lots of cool advice and knowledge out there. Not all of it is for everyone, but we’re blessed to live in a time when so much archery knowledge is so freely available.

 

My take on Joel’s theory is it’s another way of saying trust your float. I agree it’s easier to do indoors in a controlled climate but the system works outdoor in the elements as well. Any doubters on this should look at the winner of 2022 Outdoor Nationals. It’s not right for everyone, but what is.

Think comparing the float to 50/50 chance the nail lands on my foot is incorrect. There is little “chance” involved in any system these archers shoot with.

 

If your sight will return to center faster when you are off the spot then then it will also get off the spot faster if you are on the spot.

I don't agree with Mr. Turner nor disagree. I believe a heavy or light setup can work but one method won't work for everyone.

 

I think what needs to be factored in, which is part of why I brought this up, is the distribution of this float and how you define a good vs bad shot. You can still score an X without being inside out. Theres very few occasions where that matters. I suspect that the margin of float outside the 10 ring for these pros is miniscule. Look at how close the Vegas shoot was. Need magnifying glass to ascertain the score. Assuming that was the maximum distance away from centre, if his bow was say 6 ounces lighter, would it have made its way back to the line?

 

I think he is talking about those shots that you would swear were off the bull and get surprised when you walk up and it’s in the bull because you had good form and even though you didn’t really trust the float it worked for you. All shots should be like that if doing everything right.

 

Yes I do agree, but he also states that if you are shooting a Vegas face and the release breaks in the 9 ring and the arrow lands in the 9 ring, the bows too heavy.

 

I"m leaving bow at 8 pounds even. 7 ounces on the front 30" and 15 ounces on the back 12".

 

I"m leaving bow at 8 pounds even. 7 ounces on the front 30" and 15 ounces on the back 12".

 

And at what point does all this extra weight overcome the ability of your arm/shoulder to stay 'still'....in the first place. Is it easier to hold your arm straight out in front of you with 5lbs or is it easier with more weight? Lets not forget the basics before getting caught up in the semantics.

 

My bow weights at 7.7 lb. How much does yours?

 

Only you can answer that.


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Only you can answer that.


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Debatable